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TikTok overtakes YouTube for average watch time in US and UK

bbc.co.uk

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Re: TikTok overtakes YouTube for average watch time in US and UK

#101

Post by schmorptron »

lambdaba wrote: post #62
game_the0ry wrote: post #24

A couple of years ago, I noticed the youtube recommendations that would get were a lot less interesting, though still relevant to me somehow. At some point I started seeing a lot more "mainstream" content, especially after media companies figured out that they needed to have a youtube presence in order to stay relevant. So I wonder if the algorithm the switched to had something to do with them potentially losing atte…

I wish someone at YouTube could explain, but the recommendation algo is nothing like what it used to be. Every refresh would bring a gem, now it's mostly the same videos, often from the same channel if I happened to watch a few in a row... Very odd.

I noticed this as well. Good thing though, so I don't waste as much time on there.

Re: TikTok overtakes YouTube for average watch time in US and UK

#102

Post by throwaway210222 »

treeman79 wrote: post #67
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Frenchmen, Youtube is exactly the same: - algo is a black box, and uncalibrated youtube makes my eyes bleed; - own by the biggest spy on the planet, google, known for manipulating information, monopolistic behavior, participation in the worst gov programs (e.g: PRISM); - impose American censorship rules to the entire world, and makes creators do inane cuts to fit some terrible metrics Besides, the typical Tik To…

Explaining these to the average person makes you seem like a conspiracy nut case. No of some of the same people will go on about the illuminati controlling everything. But you talk specific companies or policies and you get an eye roll.

> people will go on about the illuminati controlling everything

But we do. :)

Re: TikTok overtakes YouTube for average watch time in US and UK

#103

Post by wutbrodo »

bobobob420 wrote: post #80
pilooch wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TikTok algorithm is like a tamgotchi with short memory. The echo chamber is actual much less than on other systems, or at least this is my actual understanding. I've been working on AI and ML for 20+y now, I'm always interested is testing the systems out there from the user side. Overall, I've been surprised by TikTok, as I did find it very enjoyable actually, and easily 'trainable'.

Why does YouTube not change their algorithim. It is clearly sub tier to tik tok, they have the data and skill set to provide new and entertaining videos but the recommended feed has been so stale and stagnant for a few years, constantly pushing videos you’ve seen or ones you clearly don’t want to watch. How much of tik tok’s success do you think is their algorithim for recommending content. I heard from numerous peop…

Yea, It may be as simple as the length. There's a vastly higher frequency of samples when every video is twenty seconds long.

It's also clearly designed around a different experience, a constant consume-or-scroll feed as popularized by Instagram. YouTube shorts also has this, but regular YouTube clearly doesn't, given that there's just enough latency between video skips that it feels like the algorithm is "making mistakes" at a much lower number of skips.

Re: TikTok overtakes YouTube for average watch time in US and UK

#104

Post by disgruntledphd2 »

simonh wrote: post #42
m12k wrote: post #16

TikTok seems emblematic of China's overall approach compared to the West - shows up late to the party, but studies all those hard-won lessons to copy and later surpass the most successful Western products. The free market is great at finding the superior product, but it's also messy and wasteful with all those failed attempts - why not just sit it out until a winner starts to emerge, then copy them? China seems to ha…

Tiktok is very much a product of the 'free market' segment in China. The government does have a minority ownership stake in it now, but that's very recent and they played no role in it's founding by Zhang Yiming, a programmer and serial app and online service founder.

Yeah, my understanding is that the recommendation engine was already developed for a news app popular in India, and that they grafted this onto Musical.ly (the acquisition which has now become TikTok).

Also, they spent many, many millions on ads to get the app everywhere.

Re: TikTok overtakes YouTube for average watch time in US and UK

#105

Post by disgruntledphd2 »

nova22033 wrote: post #48
tarkin2 wrote: post #28

This is a hit for US cultural dominance and influence. Americans and Brits, at least in average watch time, are now consuming media ultimately controlled by the Chinese government. And the previous election was influenced by a foreign government using American social media networks to influence, not to mention influencing the president-elect directly. Either America's own social networks are used against them or soci…

This is a bit of hit for US cultural dominance and influence. How so? Almost everything I watch on tiktok is made by American content creators..Is TikTok proper even available to Chinese residents?

Nope, there's a different app for China, called Douyin I believe.

Re: TikTok overtakes YouTube for average watch time in US and UK

#106

Post by ajkdhcb2 »

DalasNoin wrote: post #54

The headline is a bit misleading in the article: "average time per user spent on the apps is higher for TikTok... However, YouTube retains the top spot for overall time spent - not per user - as it has many more users overall." The average TikTok user spents more time, which is still interesting. Maybe kids just have more time on their hands.

I've also spent an unholy amount of time on youtube but never installed the app. Why watch videos on my phone...

Re: TikTok overtakes YouTube for average watch time in US and UK

#107

Post by disgruntledphd2 »

ourcat wrote: post #9
JoshTko wrote: post #4

TikTok has two advantages - first, an order more user data to refine it's feed algorithm and second a format that lowers the bar for content creation which allows for super niche content to be viable. The combination enables a feed that resonates.

Their recommendation algorithm is reportedly the envy of many other platforms. I heard that was pretty much what was being bid for at the time offers started floating around.

TikTok always gets a zero or 1 on each video, whereas FB only get interactions for a minority of units. This makes it a lot easier to train better models.

Re: TikTok overtakes YouTube for average watch time in US and UK

#108

Post by finfinfin »

colesantiago wrote: post #94
finfinfin wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point is that a company that is controlled by an authoritarian regime has a vast influence on the US population.

Then you must have been fine with Trump trying to ban the app then? > The point is that a company that is controlled by an authoritarian regime Hard evidence for this claim? Is TikTok Inc, controlled by China?

> Then you must have been fine with Trump trying to ban the app then?

That was an authoritarian action and I did not support it.

China tightly controls all large businesses, including ByteDance. If you need hard evidence on how this relationship works - look it up, there is plenty of information online.

Re: TikTok overtakes YouTube for average watch time in US and UK

#109

Post by wutbrodo »

28433552 wrote: post #65
MathCodeLove wrote: post #11

I feel like I'm going crazy. Hasn't TikTok been proven malicious in it's excessive user tracking and data theft? Why does everyone I know still use it? Outside of privacy concerns, doesn't the blackbox algorithm make anyone worry? We're building automated echochambers for an entire population. We're giving a Chinese company the ability to control the content consumption, and therefore beliefs and knowledge, of entire…

I stepped back from a group chat because the fellows in it swore by “Mental Health TikTok,” where therapists give mental health advice. This is concerning to me. Beyond that, the data collection and the way it mixes young-but-of-age mildly sexual content with underage guys imitating them makes me stay far away. I enjoyed the handsome men in various states of undress but couldn’t find a way to make the app not veer in…

> I stepped back from a group chat because the fellows in it swore by “Mental Health TikTok,” where therapists give mental health advice. This is concerning to me

What's concerning about this? I don't mean this rhetorically: I'm genuinely curious, as I've heard people say similar things recently.

It seems to me that, like metabolic health, there's a pretty large body of basic mental health advice that's safe and salutary, and that doesn't displace heavy-duty mental Healthcare for those who need it (in the same way that healthy recipe tips don't displace insulin shots).

Re: TikTok overtakes YouTube for average watch time in US and UK

#110

Post by Karunamon »

ipaddr wrote: post #61
elliebike wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's no different to most other social networks that commit mass abuse of user data and track everyone, everywhere. Being a US-based company doesn't make this any better, just look at Facebook. The only people who worry are people on HN. Most other people aren't aware of what's going on, or just don't care.

And the state department. Letting that on your phone is allowing your contacts, photos and text messages to be read. Same goes with facebook. But facebook will try to profit off of your data. Tiktok data goes to China. I don't know what they are doing with it..

Not if you don't give itemizing l permission for it to access those things (and it works fine without)

Where does it read text messages?

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