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How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

economist.com

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Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#371

Post by pjc50 »

p0d wrote: post #340

As a christian I believe in mercy and grace. And yes, many of us 'believers' have not practised what we preached. Many of us do try however not to be hypocrites. Here's my question. Where is mercy and grace in the midst of wokeness? I want you to believe my christian message but I will not force you to do so. I don't want to introduce laws to force you to believe what I believe. I don't want you to lose your job beca…

> I don't want to introduce laws to force you to believe what I believe

20th century America has spent years doing exactly this. It's still ongoing in Texas right at the minute. People have been fired for being atheist. Children are send to indoctrination camps for "gay conversion therapy" if they are suspected of homosexuality, a practice which leads some of them to commit suicide.

Rein in your fellow Christians and things might calm down.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#372

Post by wslack »

narrator wrote: post #302
question000 wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean I dated a transgender person, were they being paid or something? explain to me what was going on there.

They were being influenced. Influence is real. Advertising is not a trillion dollar business because it doesn't work.

Every trans person I know knew this about themselves as a young child. They were not "influenced." Many of them had no idea that being trans was possible and thought they were gay, if they knew what that was.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#373

Post by corobo »

andy_ppp wrote: post #300
lwhi wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's dangerous to dismiss transgenderism to be the result of psychological mishaps caused by environmental mishaps. You're effectively presenting a transgender person as a second class person, or a mistake. You're also aligning the ability to grow a beard with being a 1st class citizen.

Nope, what you’re doing is totally misrepresenting what I’ve said. I’m saying if there are more effeminate men you’ll have on average more people who are transgender. Myself I can barely grow a beard and have man boobs that I’m trying to get rid of and hardly any body hair (yet my Dad has a full beard and hairy chest, I’m asking why is there this big difference in just one generation) but hopefully I still count as a…

> Myself I can barely grow a beard and have man boobs that I’m trying to get rid of and hardly any body hair

Do you by chance sit around at a PC all day and get less exercise than you really should? I'm not sure I'd pin this on a biology thing just yet, there's so many things that could cause that

Losing weight and getting exercise gave me all sorts of "manly" traits. Turns out sitting around letting your muscles go to goo can mess with your systems a bunch. I have to shave too often now if anything haha

However if we wanted to turn this into a hypothesis our first stumble is that not all gender dysphoric people are overweight, so it's probably not that

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#374

Post by blub »

DanBC wrote: post #195
blub wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This book’s trying to explain why this is happening for girls: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irreversible_Damage

That book relies on the concept of ROGD, which is something that doesn't exist. Anybody pushing ROGD, or supporting other people who push ROGD, is anti-science and anti-fact. You should consider why you feel comfortable pushing something that's obviously bollocks, just because it supports your anti-trans activism. https://www.caaps.co/rogd-statement

My reply is the only one which links to a publication which attempts to directly answer OP's question and includes both praise and criticism of said publication.

I think therefore that anyone can judge for themselves whether said publication is "anti-science" or "anti-fact" and your help is not required. I feel perfectly comfortable allowing people to think for themselves, especially since this publication is not obviously bollocks: it was awarded both the Economist and Times book of the year prizes.

Finally, based on what I've seen from the scientific community around politicised topics like this one, any link (especially from US-affiliated organisations) should be by default open to questioning and not unassailable proof. Although given that it's psychology it should probably just be outright ignored for a couple of decades until they manage to form a coherent opinion.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#375

Post by luckylion »

spats1990 wrote: post #261
luckylion wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most of the "backlash" to "woke stuff" is a working-through of the cognitive dissonance this notion brings for certain people/organizations. They cannot believe that such ideas can have even token support among the broader public. But that's the thing: a lot of the woke stuff isn't publicly supported. Latinos don't care for "Latinx" [1]. Enforcing more gender-speech in Germany has decreased the support in the gener…

On the first point, a ~recent (2020) poll suggests most Latino people don't even know that "Latinx" is a word. Your post contradicts itself somewhat there. It says "the media are going crazy" over "woke stuff", but seems to make the assumption that "Latinx" is being actively pushed on Latino people, which seems like it isn't true--since if it were, far more of them would actually know it was a word. I suspect the pre…

> It says "the media are going crazy" over "woke stuff", but seems to make the assumption that "Latinx" is being actively pushed on Latino people, which seems like it isn't true--since if it were, far more of them would actually know it was a word.

You might have misunderstood my point. I'm saying the media cares, not the Latinos. They don't care, otherwise they'd be out there saying they want to be called Latinx -- instead, they don't even know that there's a debate. Similarly, most people of most cultures don't care for the concept of cultural appropriation, yet there's a fuzz in the corporate media about it.

Since German has gendered nouns with the male form usually doubling as the neutral form (e.g. teacher = Lehrer, female teacher = Lehrerin), there's been a push by the media, academics and politicians to gender (e.g. to say either Lehrende = "those who teach" or use things like Lehrer_innen which is supposed to also include transsexuals, non-binary and intersex). The public is opposed to it, but the corporate media and politicians are forcing the issue and the opposition gets stronger.

The only group that is split on the issue are those still in education, where indoctrination has become much more severe.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#376

Post by sandworm101 »

p0d wrote: post #340

As a christian I believe in mercy and grace. And yes, many of us 'believers' have not practised what we preached. Many of us do try however not to be hypocrites. Here's my question. Where is mercy and grace in the midst of wokeness? I want you to believe my christian message but I will not force you to do so. I don't want to introduce laws to force you to believe what I believe. I don't want you to lose your job beca…

>> don't want you to lose your job because you don't agree with me.

But lots of people want that power. It is within living memory that people could be fired or denied employment based on thier religion. Many today still want thier religion beliefs to be enforced against believers and non-believers alike (abortion, education, marriage, adoption, right to die etc). Not every person of faith is so liberal about the affairs of others. Many call for a return to a past where religious "values" were enforced by the state at the point of a sword.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#377

Post by [deleted] »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #135
invalidOrTaken wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To an extent left and right are asymmetrical---leftist groups tend to be groups organized around being leftist as their main purpose, while "rightist" groups (churches, police unions, gun enthusiasts) tend to be rightist incidentally . Neo Nazis feel like the exception that proves the rule.

[flagged]

[deleted]

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#378

Post by supakeen »

dragonwriter wrote: post #314
torben-friis wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I don't really see the big issue with Latinx... it seems to me an easy and correct way to refer to latinos and latinas, without saying both, or one or the other, or bringing in gender. Masculine plural is used as gender neutral for Spanish. Latinos already refers to both genders. Even fringe social groups that disagree with using the masculine for neutral terms (which are already a huge minority, since grammatical g…

> The x is an American invention that is unknown in the culture it tries to adapt It’s (both “Latinx” and the “-x” to reject the gender binary in Spanish more generally), AFAIK, a Hispanic LGBTQ culture invention, which while originating in the USA, is also used elsewhere (the “-x” ending as an emphatic rejection of the gender binary, not the specific term “Latinx”.) Though its a small minority that use it even in th…

We use 'e': latines, etc.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#379

Post by FinanceAnon »

yawaworht1978 wrote: post #327

It's just a shift from older, less flexible values like family, church etc to the more open minded approach, "do as you like". Nothing wrong with people having tattoos everywhere, green or violet hair, non conformist clothing and views. Let them be, let them express and find themselves. I am the shave every day suit kinda guy and will remain so, but if someone chooses to be different or wants to complain about new wo…

Part of me doubts that it's a permanent shift. There was a hippie movement in the 60s and 70s in the US, but conservatives are still going strong 50 years later.

Re: How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?

#380

Post by newsclues »

pjc50 wrote: post #368
narrator wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to go deep down the rabbit hole here, break your brain, probably ruin your career and seriously damage your ability to interact with woke culture ever again, you can listen to an interview with the author of the book, "The Transgender Industrial Complex" in which the author alleges with copious documentation that the transgender movement is complete astroturf. He did deep research to discover where the tr…

This is ridiculous; I've known people through their transition. It is not a fad. Has everyone forgotten famous hacker Sophie Wilson?

How do you explain groups or clusters of young children suddenly becoming trans?
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