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Zoom court hearing postponed after accused found in same location as witness

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Re: Zoom court hearing postponed after accused found in same location as witness

#151

Post by denton-scratch »

gpm wrote: post #75
tobr wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuinely, why does it matter? Why should the judge waste any attention on things like that, things that have zero significance to the matter at hand?

Consider that the only power a judge has is to say things, and write things. The legal system only works if enough people respect it and do things just because the judge said to do the thing. Our society only works if the legal system keeps working. Insisting that people respect the court is a large part of why this works. Even if maybe in some particular instance you could get away with not insisting on that, that's…

s/legal/social/

The legal system is just a buttress for social norms and conventions; and if the latter break down, there's not much hope for the former.

Of course, there are many legal issues that genuinely need lawyers and courts - for example, where there is real disagreement as to the meaning of a legal text such as a contract. But on the whole, the role of courts and lawyers is to tidy-up around the edges; if society only worked because of courts and lawyers, then it wouldn't really be working at all.

Re: Zoom court hearing postponed after accused found in same location as witness

#152

Post by ViViDboarder »

worker767424 wrote: post #120

> [Judge] Middleton then asked Harris to divulge the address where he was. Harris gave a house number on East Lafayette Street. Is this bordering on a Fifth Amendment violation since the judge asked this or a future mistrial since the defense attorney didn't try to stop it?

How is asking a question in a court proceeding a violation? That’s the point of the proceeding, no? Did the judge threaten to hold him in contempt for not answering?

Re: Zoom court hearing postponed after accused found in same location as witness

#153

Post by corin_ »

notafraudster wrote: post #121
whatthesmack wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't say that only the state is capable of helping. Most organizations that help in these situations currently in the US are private, often faith-based, and non-profit. Also to mention... to challenge preconceptions about who's behind this stuff, the current US president (who many would consider "liberal" or "leftist") made great efforts and progress toward locking up lots of people ("tough on crime"), especial…

The current US president, who anyone that isn't raised on a diet of right-wing talk radio would consider a moderate Democrat (not from the left or progressive wing of the party at all), locked up lots of people in the 1990s, a period where there was general social and political appetite for widespread incarceration. At approximately the same time, a few years earlier, the last president you mention (then a private ci…

> Thomas and Alito favour obviously expanding the use of capital punishment and view most litigation related to it a liberal plot to undermine the justice system

Have they talked/written about it being a "liberal plot" or is that just a (quite possibly entirely accurate) description of a belief that would explain their actions without their having come out and said that?

I'd be interested to learn more if you have any suggested reading on the current members of the SC (not an area I know a huge amount about).

Re: Zoom court hearing postponed after accused found in same location as witness

#154

Post by Brian_K_White »

I saw a milder version of the same thing myself a few weeks ago in a zoom traffic court. While I was waiting for my turn one of the other cases had the same thing. A guy was being charged with something about a domestic dispute, doesn't speak English very well, they ask if he has anyone that can translate, yes my wife, she leans into view, someone from the court says she's the the victim. They abort everything and schedule for some other time with some other translator.

Dude looked over 30, wife looked under 20.

Traffic court sometimes makes you grateful.

Re: Zoom court hearing postponed after accused found in same location as witness

#155

Post by corin_ »

navjack27 wrote: post #146
jyrkesh wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would assume it's the upbringing because I don't think impulse control is actually a very natural behavior. There's a reason it's called "primal rage". On the flip side, self-control, impulse control, being able to manage your emotions with a toolbox: these are skills that are learned, honed, and mastered. Sure, many people learn them through other means than from their parents, often as a survival necessity in the…

> self-control, impulse control, being able to manage your emotions with a toolbox: these are skills that are learned, honed, and mastered. I got news for ya bub. They aren't learned. They can be honed to a small degree. They cannot be mastered. When you have ADHD you realize this. And to your last thing. Not in all cases but in some.

Surely having ADHD would only give insight into whether it can be learned by someone with (that type of) ADHD, it doesn't speak to whether it's natural or learned for other people - just as someone who has a physical disability not being able to learn to ride a bike wouldn't prove that riding a bike can't be learned?

(I'm not arguing for or against the point that they can be learned, just against the "proof" that someone with ADHD has - and not because of ADHD specifically, but because generally speaking any argument which relies on "my experience proves X about humans" is likely to be short-sighted.)

Re: Zoom court hearing postponed after accused found in same location as witness

#156

Post by distances »

yomly wrote: post #150
tclancy wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What value do you see in it as a long-term teaching tool? Whenever I have caught myself feeling that way it’s because they’ve done something risky that has scared me at a subconscious level and I want to lash out. I’ve never once had a rational reason for feeling that way.

I guess the two values I see are having an extra level in your varieties of punishment - a "nuclear option" perhaps. The other is softer - I am curious how normalising pain may positively benefit a developing child. Could it build toughness? Might my child be more likely to stand up to a bully? From a self defence perspective, a big part of personal development is overcoming aversion to pain - eg not flinching in box…

> The other is softer - I am curious how normalising pain may positively benefit a developing child. Could it build toughness? Might my child be more likely to stand up to a bully?

Aren't you worried this de-stigmatizes violence, and could lead either to adoption of violence as a problem-solving tool, or in general a society that accepts everyday violence?

I'm living in a place where I never have felt physically threatened, not at dark streets or drunk alone or whatever. I do recognize large part of this is privilege of being a male, but I've always felt my physical well-being isn't threatened. I'd never try to fight back unless that's the last option, rather de-escalate, run away, call police.

Re: Zoom court hearing postponed after accused found in same location as witness

#157

Post by radu_floricica »

dheera wrote: post #6

> “Um, I’m at a house,” [NAME] said, with hesitation, giving a [STREET NAME] address in [CITY]. This should NOT have been publicized. There is enough information in the above sentence that I was able to Google for her exact address. This is a gross danger to violence victims.

There's always a price when you censor something. There's also always a price when you regulate something, too. In this particular case, the likely attacker was literally in the same house, so there's not a lot of argument to be made that the extra burden of censoring would add a similar or greater gain.

Re: Zoom court hearing postponed after accused found in same location as witness

#158

Post by astura »

jedberg wrote: post #31
yreg wrote: post #28

There is a community around watching court cases at /r/zoomcourt Judge Middleton and Deborah Davis (the attorney) from this case are very popular over there. She is even a member of the subreddit IIRC.

My understanding is that only judges can share these recordings because it would be an ethical violation for the lawyers to do it, but I wonder, why isn't it an ethical issue for the Judge?

Nominally (before Zoom court) court proceedings (and records) are open to the public.

Re: Zoom court hearing postponed after accused found in same location as witness

#159

Post by Akronymus »

whatthesmack wrote: post #99
DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Seems that some people just entirely miss that part of their upbringing, and suffer needlessly for it for the rest of their lives. ...and make things worse for the rest of us; but god forbid the state do anything about it with proactive evidence-based early-interventions or treat the perpetrators of crime with compassion and understanding too - otherwise it's called being soft-on-crime or worse: "liberal".

I wouldn't say that only the state is capable of helping. Most organizations that help in these situations currently in the US are private, often faith-based, and non-profit. Also to mention... to challenge preconceptions about who's behind this stuff, the current US president (who many would consider "liberal" or "leftist") made great efforts and progress toward locking up lots of people ("tough on crime"), especial…

Didn't he also help making asset forfeiture as bad as it is in the US nowadays?

Re: Zoom court hearing postponed after accused found in same location as witness

#160

Post by jpadkins »

huitzitziltzin wrote: post #115
DoreenMichele wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

poor impulse control This can be due to an old head injury. Head injury syndrome is a thing and one study found that upwards of 90 percent of people on Death Row had a history of head injury so severe that you could find evidence of it with an x-ray machine if there were no medical records. In other words the skull still bore the scars. So it went well beyond just a concussion.

Do you have a recent source on the head injury / death row connection? I am not doubting you but curious. I can find a study of 15 people from the early 2000’s but is there anything more recent and with a larger sample size?

you aren't going to get a very large sample size of death row inmates...
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