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System76 Pangolin Linux-first laptop with AMD internals now in stock

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Re: System76 Pangolin Linux-first laptop with AMD internals now in stock

#301

Post by ksec »

Fatalist_ma wrote: post #181

Uhh I understand that good Linux support is valuable, but the price premium for that is just too high. For the base variant(5500u, 8gb, 240gb): Pangolin - 1200$ Lenovo Ideapad 3 15 - 430$[1] For a higher-end variant(5700u, 16gb, 500gb): Pangolin - 1542$ HP 15z - 640$[2] I admit these are the absolute cheapest ones I could find(using noteb.com), but even the more premium laptops like Thinkpads are way cheaper(and AFAI…

That is the problem with basically any commodity market. The margin are so thin, it sort of hard to compete without the economy of scale. Not to mention the selling point of Linux support doesn't exactly have a large TAM.

Re: System76 Pangolin Linux-first laptop with AMD internals now in stock

#302

Post by istingray »

Mikeb85 wrote: post #269
cbsmith wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The XPS won't have AMD, and the Thinkpads with Linux pre-installed are pretty limited.

Lots of cheaper, equivalent laptops have AMD. The new Intel processors and GPUs are nice. The System76 is overpriced.

There are no other Linux-first vendors besides System76 and Purism. Dell and Lenovo seem to put up with Linux as a side project.

Re: System76 Pangolin Linux-first laptop with AMD internals now in stock

#303

Post by rgoulter »

atatatat wrote: post #276
stonecharioteer wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd actually be into that. I come from the split keyboards world. Put your god damned numpad in the middle and give me ortholinear keys on each side. I will throw money at you today.

> I come from the split keyboards world. What terrifying place is that? (I'm just poking fun, but seriously: where?)

Generally, hobbyist mechanical keyboards that you assemble by buying or fabricating a PCB, and doing a bit of soldering. Most designs have relatively easy soldering.

Some hobbyist shops may offer assembly services. If you don't want to solder, ZSA labs have a "moonlander" keyboard that looks quite nice, for a premium price.

If you're not put off by soldering, then some popular split keyboards would be the Corne (also known as "crkbd"), Kyria, lily58, Sofle.

There are also designs which are closer to a normal keyboard, like the ultimate hacking keyboard. (But, personally, I don't understand why you'd spend so much money on a keyboard and have it be asymmetric).

Re: System76 Pangolin Linux-first laptop with AMD internals now in stock

#304

Post by nobody10 »

istingray wrote: post #300
Fatalist_ma wrote: post #181

Uhh I understand that good Linux support is valuable, but the price premium for that is just too high. For the base variant(5500u, 8gb, 240gb): Pangolin - 1200$ Lenovo Ideapad 3 15 - 430$[1] For a higher-end variant(5700u, 16gb, 500gb): Pangolin - 1542$ HP 15z - 640$[2] I admit these are the absolute cheapest ones I could find(using noteb.com), but even the more premium laptops like Thinkpads are way cheaper(and AFAI…

Good Linux support is rare . Name one other USA vendor besides System76 or Purism that is Linux-first. Linux is at best a side project for Lenovo and Dell.

Just picking on "Name one other USA vendor besides System76 or Purism that is Linux-first."

Kubuntu Focus - https://kfocus.org/

Re: System76 Pangolin Linux-first laptop with AMD internals now in stock

#305

Post by ksec »

mercutio2 wrote: post #213
arnaudsm wrote: post #200

This is an huge deal : the 5700U is faster than the Mac M1 at the same wattage https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare/Apple-M1-8-Core-3200-MH...

If you have embarrassingly parallel loads, sure. But: CPU Single Thread Rating Apple M1 - 3,778 AMD 5700U - 2,636 suggests that "is faster" is going to depend on your perspective. Most loads I care about are single threaded. The 5700U is 8% faster on a synthetic multi-core benchmark vs. 30% slower on a single core benchmark. I know which CPU I'd choose if I had a choice.

It is even worst considering

1. The Max boost clock of 5700U is 4.3Ghz. Compared to M1 at 3.2Ghz

2. The TDP of 5700 is Typical TDP, it doesn't actually take into account of boost. Not that it matters in a single thread performance comparison because it wont use 15W per single core, but still relevant info to keep in mind.

On the other hand this is a Zen 2 on 7nm compared to M1 on 5nm. The Gap would be less if it was on Zen 3 and 5nm. But even then my guess it would something like 3000, still quite a bit to go to catch up with 3800.

Re: System76 Pangolin Linux-first laptop with AMD internals now in stock

#306

Post by xxs »

smichel17 wrote: post #239
deepsun wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plastic laptop cases are objectively better than metallic ones. Plastic doesn't heat up your legs that much, and good carbon plastic is stronger than steel, weight-wise. Subjectively, metallic feels better though.

What about by volume? Also, stronger meaning what? There's a combination of factors here: not just whether it breaks, but also how (dent vs crack..). Also, how well it ages. Also, how much flex does it have and how does that affect the lifespan of the internal components? I don't know those answers; perhaps carbon plastic wins on all metrics. It would be interesting to learn.

>Also, stronger meaning what?

Usually tensile strength. For example: Tensile strength: even a commodity PA6-GF30 (most half-decent tools are made of) is ~110MPa [according to ISO 527], cast Aluminum - would be ~150MPa (22K psi for the imperial folks) depending on the alloy.

Of course, most laptops would be using an ABS blend, which is the hallmark low-quality tools.

>Dents

That would depend on the top finish, not so much of the material itself.

Re: System76 Pangolin Linux-first laptop with AMD internals now in stock

#307

Post by ksec »

One thing I notice in this and Framework's laptop is how much space we are trading for upgradability. Both SO-DIMM and M2 are massive. I guess for 2TB option you need M2 2280 rather than the 2242 variant. But SO-DIMM is just huge, and you need two of them. Compared to M1 which has LPDDR5 within the package, and SSD Controller Built in.

We need something that combined the Dual Channel Support within one Slot and at least half the width of SO-DIMM.

Re: System76 Pangolin Linux-first laptop with AMD internals now in stock

#309

Post by rvz »

Would have been a go-to viable option had it not been for the Framework Laptops and the Apple Silicon lineup.

I doubt the battery life on this thing is going to last a single day or even more than 12 hours compared with the Apple Silicon laptops out there or even the upcoming M1X Laptops.

Hence this, I am in no hurry to rush into buying this contraption and will just skip it for the alternatives.

Re: System76 Pangolin Linux-first laptop with AMD internals now in stock

#310

Post by LMYahooTFY »

I wonder about AMD support, I've been running Pop OS on a Thinkpad A285 for a while and the computer freezes pretty consistently. I'm not sure if it's related to video playback but it seems like it might be a pattern.

I've tried multiple kernel versions to no avail.

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