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Arm China Has Gone Rogue

semianalysis.substack.com

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Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#421

Post by gremloni »

angelzen wrote: post #362
cletus wrote: post #91

People need to wake up to the fact that China being a potential market of >1B people is an illusion. This is particularly relevant for any tech company. Let me spell it out: Chinese companies are extensions of the state. They are tools of Chinese foreign and trade policy. What cooperation you think US companies provide the US government, it is nothing in comparison. The Chinese government will ensure that no Western…

> US government will at some point soon decide that any person born in mainland China is a security risk Chinese people earn 15-20% of graduate STEM degrees in US, double the percentage of 10 years ago, and not counting second generation Chinese. At this rate, 'US' STEM will be Chinese dominated long before anyone wakes up to the security risk. https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/IF/IF11347 https://cset.georg…

And the rest are Indians. Americans just don’t have the work ethic drilled into them to pull this off en masse.

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#423

Post by makeitdouble »

cletus wrote: post #91

People need to wake up to the fact that China being a potential market of >1B people is an illusion. This is particularly relevant for any tech company. Let me spell it out: Chinese companies are extensions of the state. They are tools of Chinese foreign and trade policy. What cooperation you think US companies provide the US government, it is nothing in comparison. The Chinese government will ensure that no Western…

A point on addressing China as market: for a non US company, I think there just isn’t any market that will be much easier to compete in either way.

If we imagine a Swedish chip maker that wants to become a global powerhouse, the US will dip a finger or two in it to make sure it mostly goes along their interests, otherwise the maker will just get banned from US use (Huawey…). China will do the same if the chips ever touch the chinese soil. Japan will tax it through the roof anyway. India is another kind of wild ride.

We’re left with the Russia, middle east, and Africa. Basically any company with big ambitions will need to choose to open up to China or US control up to a point, and understand that if they really become critical any legal ground they stand on can be swooped away with a sleight of hand.

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#424

Post by edderly »

justicezyx wrote: post #388
angelzen wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> US government will at some point soon decide that any person born in mainland China is a security risk Chinese people earn 15-20% of graduate STEM degrees in US, double the percentage of 10 years ago, and not counting second generation Chinese. At this rate, 'US' STEM will be Chinese dominated long before anyone wakes up to the security risk. https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/IF/IF11347 https://cset.georg…

What security risk? This Mr. Wu did something bad inside China, without any evidence that he was colluding with the national and local government of China. How is that translate to security risk at US domestic? And all these Chinese stem students already contributed critical work to the boom of high tech industry. You are not appreciting their hard work, and link a speculation to national security risk?! How heartles…

I have no strong opinions on this, but for background, there are a bunch of Silicon Valley types like Eric Weinstein (Thiel Capital) who maintain that there are sinister undertones to the growing influence of Chinese immigrants in Tech and Higher Education.

https://djonesvi.medium.com/eric-weinstein-on-the-secretly-c...

Obviously that can veer into uncomfortable conclusions i.e. is it true, or is this kind of racist?

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#425

Post by alasdair_ »

colordrops wrote: post #171
908B64B197 wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Here's where I think this will first come to a head: I believe the US government will at some point soon decide that any person born in mainland China is a security risk as far as working on anything national security related. This will probably extend to key industries of national importance too (eg SpaceX). Even naturalization or birth in America can't erase ties to Chinese entities, through family links for inst…

Things will get really ugly once you codify special classes citizens and other US persons. It won't happen even though conservative congresspeople have been pushing for it for decades.

It already happens with naturalized citizens not being allowed to be president.

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#426

Post by orhmeh09 »

causality0 wrote: post #346
mdavis6890 wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If China wants to impose such restrictions on Western companies, they shouldn't get access to Western markets. And that's it." Why? Why should we prohibit US citizens from purchasing things they want from wherever/whoever they want? Why would we do that to ourselves (I'm a US citizen), and to each other?

The same reason we don't let people do business with North Korea or purchase stolen goods. The same reason we shouldn't let people buy conflict diamonds or clothes made with slave labor.

How about Russell Stover chocolate? https://thecounter.org/russell-stover-uses-prison-labor-cand...

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#427

Post by mrjangles »

refenestrator wrote: post #382
Phileosopher wrote: post #287

This is difficult to parse in my Western mind. I've grown up with a constant understanding of implicit liberties, so much so that I have the freedom to openly _discuss_ my general distrust of the government. The events that float by in HN are outliers: threats of more risk, but statistically unusual enough that they're stories of interest. This means that living and acting in a country where your very _thoughts_ are…

Remember that nobody was threatened or, as a result, morally offended by China until the last few years when we figured out we couldn't keep them at the bottom of the value chain forever. How do we live in a society where we can just be aimed at a new foreign enemy and all of our free, enlightened citizens go along every time? Russia (support afghanistan), Iran (support Iraq), Iraq (support gulf emirates), Al Qaeda,…

If you want to know what caused the entire western media to change their tune and become anti-China. This here is what triggered it:

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/george-soros-davos-2019-c...

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#428

Post by otterley »

onethought wrote: post #403
civilized wrote: post #387

China has been doing this for, what, 30-40 years now? How is this news? It is astonishing to me how many people have been, apparently, sleeping under a rock for decades, and are just now announcing their bitter realizations that China is not a free market open to Western companies. Hillary Clinton did one of these announcements within the past year or so, and my eyes rolled right out of the back of my head.

So China invented paper, printing and gunpowder. That’s pretty significant IP theft… no one talks about it.

How long after it was invented was it "stolen"? Timing matters.

Re: Arm China Has Gone Rogue

#429

Post by jimbob45 »

The subtext here being that China won’t circumvent the “long” legal process to remove Mr. Wu? I wish the author had provided any information regarding how the Chinese government had responded to the situation. Surely they understand that China as a whole is a loser and not a gainer in this situation.
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