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After criticism, Apple to only seek abuse images flagged in multiple nations

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Re: After criticism, Apple to only seek abuse images flagged in multiple nations

#231

Post by radmuzom »

goodells wrote: post #65
heavyset_go wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This problem is the capability, not what it's used for. Any such capability will be abused by new use cases be it terrorism, drug trafficking, human trafficking or whatever. Plus there will inevitably be unauthorized access. Apple even says it themselves[1]: > This program is ambitious, and protecting children is an important responsibility. These efforts will evolve and expand over time. [1] https://www.apple.com/…

I can't wait until /child-safety 404s or redirects to /safety and there's a wall of marketing blurb (possibly only in Chinese at first) that explains how 'national security' concerns are reported to the CCP. This has totally pushed me over the edge, though I'll admit I was oblivious to begin with. My plan is to replace the MacBooks with a Thinkpad P15 gen 2 running Ubuntu and replace the iPhone with something running…

I started a thread on what specific actions we can take to avoid Apple and other big tech in future. While it did not gain much traction, I am hoping there are at least 1,000 people in the world who think like me and over time we will be able to influence more people.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28157281

Re: After criticism, Apple to only seek abuse images flagged in multiple nations

#232

Post by gentleman11 »

cletus wrote: post #28

And... Apple misses the point of the criticism completely. This problem is the capability, not what it's used for. Any such capability will be abused by new use cases be it terrorism, drug trafficking, human trafficking or whatever. Plus there will inevitably be unauthorized access. The only way to prevent all this is for the system not to exist. I don't buy into theories that Apple is being pressured or coerced on a…

> …Apple's reputation and user trust

This is the time to make a donation to a foss project related to the Linux desktop. Off the top of my head, there is Debian, Ubuntu, mint, gnome, plasma, the fsf, wine, or other projects that could use contributions of code or cash. It adds up and could help one of them hire an extra full timer if enough people set up recurring donations

Re: After criticism, Apple to only seek abuse images flagged in multiple nations

#233

Post by nabakin »

yunohn wrote: post #227
nabakin wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, to be factually accurate, in this case with Apple, nothing will happen. Apple only reports when it matches 30 instances of this content. They have said they plan to reduce it from 30 as they improve their algorithm.

> Well, to be factually accurate, in this case with Apple, nothing will happen. To be factually accurate, the commenter didn’t mention a number. Sending 30+ images of anything to someone’s number is trivial.

True

Re: After criticism, Apple to only seek abuse images flagged in multiple nations

#234

Post by tonyjstark »

tiahura wrote: post #208
merpnderp wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s a smart plan. Apple didn’t misunderstand the criticism, they just have ulterior motives. It’s the only rational explanation.

“It’s the only rational explanation.” Or, perhaps they feel really strongly about child exploitation?

Then they would not allow pay-to-play in-app purchases

Re: After criticism, Apple to only seek abuse images flagged in multiple nations

#235

Post by mda »

norov wrote: post #62
cletus wrote: post #28

And... Apple misses the point of the criticism completely. This problem is the capability, not what it's used for. Any such capability will be abused by new use cases be it terrorism, drug trafficking, human trafficking or whatever. Plus there will inevitably be unauthorized access. The only way to prevent all this is for the system not to exist. I don't buy into theories that Apple is being pressured or coerced on a…

The only explanation that makes sense to me is that they are doing huge damage to their reputation and trust for bigger reasons. Perhaps there are international or national security issues they are told to comply with that are not quite in the public view yet.

Why? "A huge fuck up while trying to be seen as champion of protecting children" perfectly explains the situation

Re: After criticism, Apple to only seek abuse images flagged in multiple nations

#237

Post by pembrook »

katbyte wrote: post #191
zepto wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt that. I mentioned it to a non-tech person today. They hadn’t seen the news, and their first instinct was to empathize with the Apple executives having to confront that their products are enabling pedophiles.

hearin the number of CSAM reports apple made (265) vs facebook (10 million) changed my perspective. i don't like it but they are going to have to start scanning icloud photos sometime

I don’t think anybody has a problem with iCloud scanning (don’t they do it already?). Apple owns their servers, so I don’t care if they scan them.

It’s the on-device scanning that is the massive overreach. It’s like being forced to allow a government employee to live in your home and watch your behavior 24/7 for anything they don’t like.

“Oh but John is only looking for specific bad behavior like drug use, you don’t have to worry. He would never report you for anything else, we promise! If you have nothing to hide, you shouldn’t be upset that John is living with you now!”

Re: After criticism, Apple to only seek abuse images flagged in multiple nations

#238

Post by mda »

n8cpdx wrote: post #98
pembrook wrote: post #72

This is by far the biggest misstep of Tim Cook’s tenure at Apple thus far. If they don’t kill this program soon, it’s going to overshadow the entire upcoming iPhone event, and will follow Apple around like a dark cloud for years. I can see the headlines now: “New iPhone launches amid massive new privacy concerns.” Anytime someone praises Apple for privacy, anywhere on the internet, there will be a tidal wave of peopl…

The folks who choose iPhone in part because of a perception of relative privacy and respect for the user (like myself) will think twice. My two concerns are that Android as an ecosystem is almost certainly still worse, and that the vast majority of users will not care. I’m tempted to jailbreak my devices going forward, although I guess the folks at Apple would say that makes me a pedophile. Edit: seeking recommendati…

I would never ever touch anything made by Apple from now on. I was never a fan, but was considering getting an ipad for drawing etc. After this, Never.

Re: After criticism, Apple to only seek abuse images flagged in multiple nations

#239

Post by benhurmarcel »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #164
lethologica wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much of an impact do you think this will have on the non tech savvy user though? Most people already don't care about ad tracking, location tracking, etc. I think your standard user will just shrug this off and go "eh, I have nothing to hide and it's good for the kids"

"Apple is scanning every image you upload" will certainly have a measurable effect on non-tech users, even if the details are more nuanced.

Which is stupid because it’s also true for all other major cloud providers.

Re: After criticism, Apple to only seek abuse images flagged in multiple nations

#240

Post by benhurmarcel »

CommieBobDole wrote: post #75
schappim wrote: post #9

With this much bad PR (and Apple hates bad PR), why is Apple pretty much holding its position?

The thing that strikes me as most suspicious is their insistence on keeping the client-side scanning feature while wrapping it in all sorts of supposed restrictions so it's essentially server-side scanning, just implemented on the client device for some reason. If the problem is "We need to scan stuff on iCloud for CSAM" then "Let's build a client-side scanning agent and distribute it to hundreds of millions of devic…

It’s quite simple, they would like to store photos without being able to see them, only knowing they’re not CP. If they scan on server, they need to be able to see all photos, and eventually give them to any requesting authority.

So the reasonable approach is to make clients that only upload photos that are not CP. The problem is that the implementation of that feels creepier than they anticipated.

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