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Schizophrenia linked to marijuana use disorder is on the rise, study finds

cnn.com

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Re: Schizophrenia linked to marijuana use disorder is on the rise, study finds

#171

Post by Ovah »

tomrod wrote: post #159
Ovah wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm speaking as a medical student. And I can't speak for what it's like in the US - only Sweden. Here it's not uncommon for schizofrenic patients to self medicate with marijuana. I guess it increases their quality of life until they have just a little too much and end up having a psychosis. That said, at least among Swedish psychiatrists, it's well know that marijuana can trigger schizophrenia in people that are ~16…

By what pathway is the schizophrenia triggered? And is the trigger causal or catalytic?

I guess that's the thing with psychiatry: the whole field is pretty far away from basic science, mechanisms etc. My (second hand) understanding is it actually triggers schizofrenia in 16 y.o. people who would not otherwise have gotten it. Not sure if it's clinical experience or if there is data to back it up. The 16 yo-scenario is one of the few medical arguments I've heard for why there should be an age limit on marijuana.

Re: Schizophrenia linked to marijuana use disorder is on the rise, study finds

#172

Post by michaelmrose »

ajkjk wrote: post #161
michaelmrose wrote: post #104

No understood method that marijuana could possibly cause the condition check. Trivially comprehensible in terms of increasing usage or increasing admission of usage check. > our findings will have to be replicated elsewhere Check > "long-observed association between cannabis and schizophrenia is likely partially causal in nature," Weasel words. If they had printed their article on toilet paper at least it would be go…

Sneering at the article doesn't really make your case more convincing. Instead it just seems like it provoked an overly-defensive reaction.

The article is so bad it actually denigrates the publication by its existence and lends unearned weight to the degenerates criticism of CNN. I don't personally have a dog in the fight.

Re: Schizophrenia linked to marijuana use disorder is on the rise, study finds

#173

Post by bjourne »

johnnyApplePRNG wrote: post #140

I have enjoyed smoking Cannabis for decades, but a recent bought of financial difficulty coupled with a desire to get programming last week has shown some teeth on the cute little bubbly image of Cannabis in my mind. I started smoking more (due to stress) and trying to complete a new project (financial difficulty) and it was just a nightmare. It's noticeably more difficult to concentrate and retain new information wh…

A few joints per night? That's a whole lot, isn't it?

Re: Schizophrenia linked to marijuana use disorder is on the rise, study finds

#174

Post by samatman »

dqpb wrote: post #117
stevev wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My experience is opposite. My experience with cannabis use using a simple activity. Sober, I can clean my office without much thinking and if I had to repeatedly do it, I’d probably do it the same fashion every time. On cannabis, I’m able to see what I believe to be the more or most efficient way of cleaning my office, garage and rooms. I could probably come up with a few ways or road maps for doing so. I don’t know…

You should record yourself cleaning in both situations and then compare. Otherwise, you are merely comparing your perception of your self, which obviously is altered in the second case.

Sure, that would be interesting on some level.

But I see the objective as cleaning the room, not having a clean room, so a subjective experience of being more engaged and enjoying it more is intrinsically valuable.

If it takes a lot longer or the results aren't as good, that changes things, sure, but this can be settled with a timer and a before/after photo. Controlling for degree-of-mess probably adds so much noise that this probably isn't useful in practice.

Re: Schizophrenia linked to marijuana use disorder is on the rise, study finds

#175

Post by lrdswrk00 »

sarsway wrote: post #143
lrdswrk00 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Daily toker and edible eater; I’m high now. Hit the bong and a cartridge multiple times. I’ve also successfully upgraded large chunks of my employers infra code; tests green, deploys green. It’s no different than coffee to me at this point; I figured out working with those jitters and anxiety. I even saw shimmering with caffeine I’ve never seen on THC. I’m pretty sure a whole lot of the behavior is just subculture st…

Don't you feel it makes you a bit more stupid? For me, as soon as it becomes a daily habit for more then 2 weeks, the negative sides start to outweigh the benefits. It really does mess with short term memory, they say an average person can remember 9 things at once, and I'm pretty sure weed drastically reduces that. To the point where people in conversations will actually notice you can't remember well what you just…

Daily != all day

Honestly, I only care about long term memory.

Short term was mutilated by todo apps and calendars already.

I want to reserve my memory for interesting ideas and moments. Not groceries and vacuuming.

This thread is making me think my way of prioritizing and doing is, not novel, but different than the replies is all.

I play guitar and piano, I don’t own a TV, I do use a tablet for movies but once or twice a week. I play Tetris on my kids Switch rarely, otherwise got bored with video games years ago, I don’t use social media. I exercise daily but don’t watch sports.

I have a lot less cultural “noise” in my face than many, yet I live in a big metro area.

Maybe that affords me the mental bandwidth to work with weed?

Re: Schizophrenia linked to marijuana use disorder is on the rise, study finds

#176

Post by gwern »

kvathupo wrote: post #16

As usual, a sensational headline averring a research article's causal hypothesis, of which the PI even calls for reproducibility. Reading such paltry science articles makes me really appreciate papers like Quanta, whose reporters seem to actually have a semblance of domain knowledge. Indeed, no discussion of the existing link between schizophrenia and tobacco smoking, in conjunction with the increased availability of…

The population level prevalence is where we should see this. If cannabis really did cause SCZ, as opposed to merely being self-medication, general drug use dysfunctionality, or possibly just accelerating SCZ onset but not increasing total cases, we should see incredibly high rates in recreational legalizing jurisdictions where prevalence is now a large fraction of the population. Instead, buried at the end, we get

"The findings could help explain the "general increase in the incidence of schizophrenia that has been observed in recent years" and provides some support that the "long-observed association between cannabis and schizophrenia is likely partially causal in nature," the study said."

OK then...

Re: Schizophrenia linked to marijuana use disorder is on the rise, study finds

#177

Post by codr7 »

GordonS wrote: post #148
bilekas wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've hit the nail on the head with my experience. I have noticed this with a brother who smoke daily.. I never really put it down to the marijuana use entirely, but more of an aversion to any kind of confrontation/disagreement that might make him second guess himself etc. Personally I can't smoke it anymore, I get super anxious now and nervous. I don't enjoy it, but I can see why some people who enjoy it would rath…

> Personally I can't smoke it anymore, I get super anxious now and nervous I've heard so many people say the same thing, that they used to enjoy using cannabis, then some years later they find it induces anxiety, jitters and nervousness - I wonder what the mechanism behind this anxiety is? Is it as simple as "modern" cannabis strains having much THC than older ones, or is it something else, possibly age-related, like…

Like Shrooms, Cannabis will sooner or later confront you with aspects of yourself that you're not entirely comfortable with.

There was always strong weed, and hashish; it just means you either consume less or fall asleep.

Hormones are possible, I guess.

Re: Schizophrenia linked to marijuana use disorder is on the rise, study finds

#178

Post by tartoran »

riemannzeta wrote: post #135
jklinger410 wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Untreated neuro-divergent people tend to use recreational drugs for medicinal purposes. And psychoactive drug usage is directly linked with the early onset of otherwise dormant schizophrenia, as well as a myriad of other mental disorders. There is no science to state that psychoactives cause these mental disorders. In fact, current medical science states the opposite, that psychoactives do NOT cause, but exacerbate,…

Presented for your consideration without comment: https://adai.uw.edu/pubs/pdf/2017mjbipolar.pdf

I find it somewhat funny that this is written by Susan A. Stoner, PhD, Research Consultant.

Re: Schizophrenia linked to marijuana use disorder is on the rise, study finds

#179

Post by ModernMech »

01100011 wrote: post #139
lrdswrk00 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Daily toker and edible eater; I’m high now. Hit the bong and a cartridge multiple times. I’ve also successfully upgraded large chunks of my employers infra code; tests green, deploys green. It’s no different than coffee to me at this point; I figured out working with those jitters and anxiety. I even saw shimmering with caffeine I’ve never seen on THC. I’m pretty sure a whole lot of the behavior is just subculture st…

Sort of sounds like me a decade ago. If you find yourself still doing the same job in a decade, I think you'll know why. Tech jobs are very compatible with weed. The sort of tactical, short term thinking you need to apply current knowledge to problems works well. It's great for crafting clever, short-term solutions and hacking your way through things. If that's all you ever want to be, smoke weed everyday man, why no…

There's a line from the show "Suits" that really highlights your point I think. Essentially the show is about this wunderkind who conned his way into becoming a lawyer at a top firm. He smokes weed, and the partner at the firm wants him to quit. The partner explains "It's okay if you want to smoke weed. But that's what weed smokers do. They smoke. If you want to do other things, like work at this firm, you've gotta quit weed, because you can't do both." I think that's very true.

Re: Schizophrenia linked to marijuana use disorder is on the rise, study finds

#180

Post by Barrin92 »

_jjkk wrote: post #126
hereforphone wrote: post #2

I can only speak from personal experience, which is of course limited. I smoked occasionally in my 20s, but not since (I'm middle-aged now). I've been friends and acquaintances with many people that smoke a lot. I see a trend among these people - not necessarily schizophrenia (I'm not a psychologist and probably wouldn't even notice a mild case) - but instead a consistent arrogance and self-importance. It's peculiar…

> they may be contributing very little to society (or maybe a lot), but regardless there's a sense of superiority A sober individual's brain is operating on standard (often societally installed) reward mechanism, including "succeeding" on certain self-evaluated measures like "contributions to society" It's commonly said that weed makes you "OK with being bored". i.e. standard reward mechanisms mentioned above don't r…

well apathetic individuals still rely on the society they are in, most of the time anyway. I think this is where the narcissism perception comes in.

Most stoners in particular people who smoke a lot and for a long time at least in my experience become apathetic and to a degree dependent on their environment. They rely on others to organize their lives, even get simple chores done, they become sort of lethargic. And when you have an individual like that who also acts indifferently towards it you create (I think a justified) negative perception.

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