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Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

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Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#191

Post by pahn »

Mixtape wrote: post #71
lima wrote: post #51

Slack has a fun dark pattern - they purposefully remove functionality from their web app to make you install their native app. The web app has a workspace switcher sidebar, but it only appears on ChromeOS, where you can't install the native client. https://webapps.stackexchange.com/questions/144258/slacks-we...

Reddit is just as guilty of this. If you want to see all the comments on a thread on their mobile site, you're pushed to install their official app and presumably create an account when doing so. As far as I can tell, the best workaround is to use the desktop site.

i can recommend teddit, that's reddit without the annoying stuff: https://teddit.net/

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#192

Post by Stratoscope »

bogwog wrote: post #152

A common one is fake consent popups for system notifications. Websites need to ask for consent before sending system notifications via the Notifications API. If a user declines, that website is blocked from asking again (for obvious reasons) But many websites cheat this by showing a fake consent popup designed to mimic what the browser would show. If a user clicks "Decline" on the fake popup, the website won't show t…

I get these all the time on mobile websites, and arrived at the same solution you did: tap Accept on the fake popup and then Block on the real consent box.

I suppose a site could trick me by making their fake popup look exactly like the real one. But in that case I would tap Block and be no worse off, other than seeing the same notification again the next time, at which point I would probably figure out their trick.

I thought of explaining this to some friends to help spare them some needless popups, but decided it was too complicated and would likely just confuse them. This is not an insult toward my friends, just a reminder that something that seems simple to you or me may be very puzzling for most people, no matter how intelligent they are.

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#195

Post by amaccuish »

amluto wrote: post #126
jrockway wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm highly in favor of making this illegal. My credit card expired and I switched my NYT subscription from through their website to through Apple (so I could cancel), and they sent my account to collections! Working with the collections agency to get it removed was easy, however. I guess the law that I would be in favor of is twofold: 1) You must be able to cancel subscriptions from the same website that you created…

I would be in favor of a different approach: a merchant should not, under any circumstances, be able to remove money from an account, charge a credit card, or otherwise take money from someone without the explicit authorization of the customer. In this context, explicit means one of two things: 1. The customer intentionally authorized that specific transaction. A specific transaction means one transaction. If a merch…

>The merchant may register a subscription or other recurring charge arrangement with the customer’s bank or card provider.

An advantage of Direct Debits in the UK is that I see them all in my banking app and can cancel them individually. A company is legally required to gain my consent again before charging again.

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#196

Post by wolpoli »

chestervonwinch wrote: post #145
lima wrote: post #51

Slack has a fun dark pattern - they purposefully remove functionality from their web app to make you install their native app. The web app has a workspace switcher sidebar, but it only appears on ChromeOS, where you can't install the native client. https://webapps.stackexchange.com/questions/144258/slacks-we...

Can you explain why this is a dark pattern? How does slack benefit from you using the native app vs. the web app?

One major benefit of native app over web app is their ability to send notifications to get the user's attention.

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#197

Post by r_singh »

bogwog wrote: post #152

A common one is fake consent popups for system notifications. Websites need to ask for consent before sending system notifications via the Notifications API. If a user declines, that website is blocked from asking again (for obvious reasons) But many websites cheat this by showing a fake consent popup designed to mimic what the browser would show. If a user clicks "Decline" on the fake popup, the website won't show t…

I was not aware about this but stackoverflow shows me their consent box (and on every stack exchange site) everyday

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#198

Post by AbortedLaunch »

pindab0ter wrote: post #161
sandermvanvliet wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked at a large online retailer in NL that got told they needed to change their delivery promise because that’s not a promise you can actually keep. So it does happen, but probably not often enough.

Which online retailer was that? Happen to have a news item to link to?

Coolblue. They violated the advertising code. The verdict in Dutch is available at https://www.reclamecode.nl/uitspraken/uitspraak/huishouden-e...

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#199

Post by reaperducer »

zemo wrote: post #99
dylan604 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Etsy does a "Only 4 items left, but 7 people have it in their cart" or something similarly worded

Etsy users put things in their cart to bookmark them. I haven't been there for six years now, but one of the problems I worked on at Etsy was getting people to stop using their cart as a bookmarking tool. While I was there I worked on the functionality to fave an item as well as the functionality to add items to a List of favorites. There was another tool called Treasuries for this purpose that we phased out, so ther…

users continued to put things in their cart "so they wouldn't forget them". It was a very frustrating result; this was the exact behavior we were hoping that Lists would eliminate.

My wife does this, not just to Etsy, but on all kinds of e-commerce sites. So I apologize on her behalf.

I suspect that it's related that she's also one of those people who will never bookmark a web page. Instead, she keeps a hundred tabs open. I don't understand it. Some people are just wired that way.

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#200

Post by andreilys »

calrueb wrote: post #34

Push notifications and their subtle ability to form usage habits (see notification -> open app -> browse feed) is a "Dark Pattern" that is used all across the consumer app industry. You can tell how focused a company is on growth and engagement by how many notifications you get a day (Clubhouse for instance slammed me with notifications until I shut them off).

Clubhouse has one of the worst notification management systems ever.

There’s no way to select specific notifications you want (e.g. person you follow starts a room). Instead you get inundated with useless notifications about random rooms.

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