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Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

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Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#41

Post by bogwog »

dqv wrote: post #30
jb1991 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you are forced to download the app and wait to check to see if it's compatible or no The App Store doesn’t let me download apps that are not compatible with my device.

>The App Store doesn’t let me download apps that are not compatible with my device. Let's not split hairs over this. I just got rid of my iPad that does. You tap "get" on the app and after doing something for 5-10 seconds it pops up a modal that says it's not compatible. Why was the app store showing apps to me that are not compatible or, rather, why was there no way to filter out the ones that are not compatible?

> Why was the app store showing apps to me that are not compatible or, rather, why was there no way to filter out the ones that are not compatible?

To show you what you're missing out by not buying the latest iPad

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#42

Post by dqv »

Hnrobert42 wrote: post #35
dqv wrote: post #21

Great I'm going to submit one about how the Apple iOS store forces you to get rid of your old devices and buy new ones. They make it extremely inconvenient to find out which apps are supported on your device. They don't hide the apps that aren't, so you are forced to download the app and wait to check to see if it's compatible or not.

I don’t think that is a dark pattern.

Could you elaborate on why you don't think it's a dark pattern?

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#43

Post by dylan604 »

mimsee wrote: post #11

Ecommerce sites showing a "27 people are watching this right now" alongside the product but from source code it turns out to be a Math.random()

Etsy does a "Only 4 items left, but 7 people have it in their cart" or something similarly worded

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#44

Post by shiftpgdn »

dmix wrote: post #27
fpig wrote: post #17

The worst one is probably trying to make it hard for users to stop paying for a service, like cancelling a subscription. That shit should be punishable by literal prison time.

About 10yrs ago NBA did this to me. They made it impossible to cancel a $99/m sub. Their instructions were login and go to the cancel button but the cancel button was broken and said call this number. But no one ever picked up the number. I will never buy a NBA branded thing after that obvious bullshit scam.

New York Times does this also. As far as I can tell it's literally impossible to cancel a subscription. I had to close the card attached to my account.

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#45

Post by dylan604 »

airstrike wrote: post #20
mimsee wrote: post #11

Ecommerce sites showing a "27 people are watching this right now" alongside the product but from source code it turns out to be a Math.random()

As disingenuous as this may be, I feel it's probably not one of the most harmful examples

Anything attempting to falesly manipulate someone with FOMO should be punishable. If not with jail time, then heavy fines. If not that, they should be forced to do the GoT walk of shame.

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#46

Post by MisterBastahrd »

Here's a fun one:

An e-commerce website that offers a subscription page for signup but requires you to contact customer service by phone or email in order for you to cancel. Went through this recently with Bespoke Post. I sent the cancellation email, their customer service person replied saying that they would instead suspend my subscription for three months, and required me to send them another email.

I'd LOVE to see an FTC rule that requires companies who take subscriptions by web have link on the account page to unsubscribe by web.

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#47

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

I had an experience a couple of days ago with exactly this type of thing (I downloaded the comment form, and I'll send it in).

In this case, it nearly cost the app maker a sale (I doubt they'll go out of business on the loss of my sale. As it happened, they didn't actually lose the sale).

I wanted to ID some of the plants in my yard, looking for native vs. introduced, so I downloaded a couple of apps. One was a good one, but was really a "crowdsourced" one. I had to sign up for an account, and participate in a community. Not a showstopper; but not really what I was looking for. I'm into instant gratification.

The other one was an ML-type app that would analyze photos in realtime.

When I started it up, it immediately wanted me to get the in-app purchase to the "premium" version, which is actually a yearly subscription.

The dark pattern, was how they did that. They obfuscated and deprecated the navigation to the free variant. It was almost impossible to see the buttons behind the premium banner, and it was difficult to actually touch them.

At first, I immediately shitcanned the app, as I assumed that you were required to get a subscription before using it at all.

I did a bit more research, and everyone was saying it was a decent app, and that it could be used without the subscription.

So I tried it again. This time, I squinted, and found the links.

It worked really well. I'll be getting the subscription.

The moral of the story is that they were so big on a dark pattern, trying to force new users to start paying immediately, that they actually drive off sales. The app works well. They don't need to hide it. That's what apps that suck do. This app does not suck.

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#48

Post by thow-01187 »

chiefofgxbxl wrote: post #8

Windows 10 does not respect the "default browser" setting when opening web-based content through apps. For example, clicking on "Help" links or search results from the start menu always opens in Edge. This seems far worse than their IE-bundling issue back in the day... at least users have a few web browsers to choose from, but what good is that when user preference is overridden?

Google does this even more egregiously with Android - my default browser is Firefox, but any links from Google News, Google Assistant and other Google software open in Chrome.

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#49

Post by saagarjha »

dqv wrote: post #21

Great I'm going to submit one about how the Apple iOS store forces you to get rid of your old devices and buy new ones. They make it extremely inconvenient to find out which apps are supported on your device. They don't hide the apps that aren't, so you are forced to download the app and wait to check to see if it's compatible or not.

Isn't there a literal "Compatibility" section in the App Store listing where it tells you if the app will work on your device or not?

Re: Request for comments regarding topics to be discussed at Dark Patterns workshop

#50

Post by vultour »

dqv wrote: post #21

Great I'm going to submit one about how the Apple iOS store forces you to get rid of your old devices and buy new ones. They make it extremely inconvenient to find out which apps are supported on your device. They don't hide the apps that aren't, so you are forced to download the app and wait to check to see if it's compatible or not.

There's a "Compatibility" section under each app which tells you whether it works on your device. You can also click on it so it tells you exactly which OS versions are supported.
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