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It's your device, you should be able to repair it

bbc.com

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Re: It's your device, you should be able to repair it

#531

Post by joshspankit »

joshspankit wrote: post #470
IronWolve wrote: post #411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Louis explains its a david vs goliath situation, tech companies pay lobbyists to argue against right to repair. Small working repair shops cant afford to travel to these meetings, and not get paid. This is why the fund raiser, the public needs lobbyists to represent them against the corporate lobbyists. Its also bad that these companies are funding/donating to politicians to go against the publics interest.

For a really stellar example, see the Washington Right to Repair hearing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBR8IvXVwsE (Lewis at 15:10) At one point a senator asks why someone should be restricted from replacing a fan on a broken Xbox, the lobbyist said (paraphrasing) "I hear what you're saying and am not listening, but let's do the real talking in private " Here's a breakdown of the exchange between the senator and t…

(How Lewis comes in to this: he primed the discussion by giving some great and down-to-earth analogies at the beginning of the hearing)

Re: It's your device, you should be able to repair it

#532

Post by hilbert42 »

google234123 wrote: post #380
hilbert42 wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Everything from the design process to the assembly and repair is completely different today than it was 50 years ago." 1. Yes, and that needs to change—and very soon at that. A short while ago I counted over one hundred x86 motherboards that were current and readily available from just one single manufacturer. I spent many hours trying to differentiate the minor—almost insignificant—differences between many of these…

> A short while ago I counted over one hundred x86 motherboards that were current and readily available from just one single manufacturer.... This nonsense is a deliberate marketing ploy and there ought to be definite penalties against it... This is authoritarian nonsense.

The only comment I'd offer is that on the political compass you are in a diametrically opposite corner to me (and I'd add to many others in the Right to Repair movement).

Thus we'd never agree and I'd never expect it. So be it.

Re: It's your device, you should be able to repair it

#533

Post by hilbert42 »

michaelmrose wrote: post #427
google234123 wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A short while ago I counted over one hundred x86 motherboards that were current and readily available from just one single manufacturer.... This nonsense is a deliberate marketing ploy and there ought to be definite penalties against it... This is authoritarian nonsense.

There is no reason they can't have 100 slightly different motherboards they just need to maintain and provide proper docs on the lot and follow other reasonable standards.

I have already given you a reason, and they definitely don't maintain the docs—so that's another one.

Re: It's your device, you should be able to repair it

#534

Post by hilbert42 »

jpttsn wrote: post #430
hilbert42 wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"a bricked phone is just spare parts (less the main board)." The main board should be just as repairable as any other device. If that requires changes to copyright law, the DMCA and or even WIPO treaties then that will eventually happen. It's not that many years ago—certainly well within my lifetime—that 'deep' repairs of this kind were not only commonplace but actually encouraged by manufacturers. (If you want examp…

I like the better performance of computers now. If lower repairability is a way to pay for that, that’s great.

"If lower repairability is a way to pay for that, that’s great.'

You are implying the two concepts are incompatible. There is no reason why they should be other than a manufacturer's planned obsolescence strategy, which is what the Right to Repair movement is all about and fighting to fix.

Re: It's your device, you should be able to repair it

#535

Post by operator-name »

JoshTko wrote: post #465
operator-name wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But also look at the AirPods Pro vs Galaxy Buds+: https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/AirPods+Pro+Teardown/127551 https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Samsung+Galaxy+Buds++Teardow... One has a zero whilst the other has a 7 by ifixit's rating.

Buds are heavier, larger by volume, and are less water resistant.

Weight isn't an important metric unless it's greater than the threshold of uncomfortableness. The majority of the weight difference comes from the extra battery which is a tradeoff.

Similarly for volume, in which the case dimensions is the important metric. Once again the volume is a battery tradeoff.

As for water resistance yes, the buds+ are IP2X versus IP4X. Under normal use this isn't important, but if argued this is the better point than bulkiness.

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/tools/compare/samsung-gala...

The point is that these are comparable devices and repairability doesn't have to make the drastic tradeoffs as your example of the fairphone 3.

Re: It's your device, you should be able to repair it

#536

Post by zepto »

fsflover wrote: post #526
zepto wrote: post #520

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is no different from 11 year old Apple laptops.

But it is different from GNU/Linux phones, which will be supported forever.

1. So why did you mention laptops? Seems like a false comparison.

2. What 11 year old GNU/Linux phone is supported today let alone ‘forever’?

Re: It's your device, you should be able to repair it

#537

Post by zepto »

fsflover wrote: post #527
zepto wrote: post #505

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is not evidence of anything. There are many reasons that third party service is cheaper that have nothing to do with some conspiracy by Apple.

AFAIK the price difference is so huge that no reasonable explanation (except the "conspiracy", i.e., greed) is possible.

I’d be curious to see your statistics on the price differences. Do you have a link?

Here are some reasonable explanations for how third parties cut costs without resort to a conspiracy:

1. Less warranty on repairs.

2. Lower cost substitute parts.

3. Lower quality control,

4. Less training for staff.

5. Lower profit margins, leading to unsustainable businesses.

Re: It's your device, you should be able to repair it

#538

Post by zepto »

fsflover wrote: post #528
zepto wrote: post #500

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It obviously does. If the phones are still in service, then by definition they are not obsolete .

Reread the thread. In this thread, the OP is speaking about design obsolescence.

> Reread the thread. In this thread, the OP is speaking about design obsolescence.

I don’t need to reread it. My response applies to design obsolescence.

Relatively few people upgrade every year these days. The fact that the old devices are still desirable negates the idea that people don’t want them because they look outdated. I.e. changes in design are not causing people to stop using the devices.

For design obsolescence to apply to Apple, workable devices would need to be retired from service early because they were no longer seen as desirable.

That isn’t happening.

Re: It's your device, you should be able to repair it

#540

Post by zepto »

fsflover wrote: post #529
zepto wrote: post #521

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine that! To imagine it requires understanding how technology works. Batteries are chemical processes - they degrade slowly over time. An older battery produces less power, and so can’t support the same peak performance. You can therefore extend the useful life of the battery by throttling the CPU performance to within the power envelope provided by the battery. It’s fairly simple to understand.

Apple should simply allow easy replacing the battery and not deceive their customers with "helpful updates", which make devices slow. This is anti-consumer, as proven by the lawsuit.

Apple does allow easy replacing of the battery. Just go into an Apple store and ask for a replacement.

Nothing was proven by the lawsuit, since it never went to trial, you know this so it’s unclear why you’d repeat this falsehood.

As for not your suggestion that Apple not slow the devices down to extend the battery life and have users just replace the battery, that seems misguided.

Why would you want users to be forced to buy unnecessary battery replacements and further damage the environment by wasting working batteries?

It’s much better for the devices to be able to continue to use the batteries for longer, don’t you think?

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