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YouTube suspends account for linking to a PhD research on WPA2 vulnerability

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Re: YouTube suspends account for linking to a PhD research on WPA2 vulnerability

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would literally beat the current situation by a country mile. The goal isn't to perfect the YouTube flagging algo, after all ... an adversarial algo is a small price to pay.

>That would literally beat the current situation by a country mile. I don't think google agrees.

Google likely only agrees with whatever choice makes them the most money. Whatever decision they make will always be jaded by how they think it will affect their stock price.

Re: YouTube suspends account for linking to a PhD research on WPA2 vulnerability

#192
post #16
post #4

>Anyhow, I truly believe humanity has to rollback to operating at a human scale. >Using algorithms to flag content is totally fine… problem is when humans cannot interact with humans anymore and AI gets to chose what is right and wrong. Can't agree more.

The thing is, we have to make sure we're OK with the consequences of going this way. Would people be happy to wait for days, maybe weeks, for their video to be approved for upload to YouTube? Would that work with the current society's attention span? Is YouTube as we know it actually feasible without AI-based moderation? Can it be a sustainable business with an army of human moderators and/or a drastically reduced sc…

> Would people be happy to wait for days, maybe weeks, for their video to be approved for upload to YouTube?

Well presumably Google being one of the worlds wealthiest corporations could hire and pay people a living wage to match the demand of users looking to upload videos to YouTube. It is in YouTube’s interest as it only exists and makes money on this very user generated content.

Yeah it’s great YouTube exists and can market to content creators about its market capture audience, but maybe it would be a better system without the middleman as anyone can upload a video anywhere on the internet making it instantly viewable by billions

Re: YouTube suspends account for linking to a PhD research on WPA2 vulnerability

#193
post #4

>Anyhow, I truly believe humanity has to rollback to operating at a human scale. >Using algorithms to flag content is totally fine… problem is when humans cannot interact with humans anymore and AI gets to chose what is right and wrong. Can't agree more.

That's exactly the point, this issue was known as a problem in 1977 published in Computers Don't Argue, but developed in 2010s as a feature

https://archive.org/details/bestofcreativeco00ahld/page/133/...

Re: YouTube suspends account for linking to a PhD research on WPA2 vulnerability

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where are people escaping to? Are people publishing their own content on Gopher or BitTorrent nowadays? These platforms have a perfect balance of usability and freedom. They can take over the world.

It seems like they are making their own sites. Nebula is one such place where a few of the higher quality content creators are going. I've no idea if it'll work, but they are trying. https://watchnebula.com/

The problem with these techniques is discover ability. How do you build an online audience without paying google for advertisements?

Re: YouTube suspends account for linking to a PhD research on WPA2 vulnerability

#195
post #16
post #4

>Anyhow, I truly believe humanity has to rollback to operating at a human scale. >Using algorithms to flag content is totally fine… problem is when humans cannot interact with humans anymore and AI gets to chose what is right and wrong. Can't agree more.

The thing is, we have to make sure we're OK with the consequences of going this way. Would people be happy to wait for days, maybe weeks, for their video to be approved for upload to YouTube? Would that work with the current society's attention span? Is YouTube as we know it actually feasible without AI-based moderation? Can it be a sustainable business with an army of human moderators and/or a drastically reduced sc…

The answers to all your questions is no, which is precisely the point the author is trying to make.

If we made the case for operating "at human scale" Youtube would be amongst first casualties.

to your last point :

> Anyone can upload a video and make it viewable by billions, instantly. I think we shouldn't forget how amazing this actually is.

By the same reasoning, COVID-19 is similarly amazing.

Opinions move on : Youtube is 15 years old now. It's a practical monopoly, being the worlds 2nd most visited website. I wont deny it's utility - but it's a gross centralisation who's modus operandi present significant questions - chiefly, Is it right that it has for years circumvented nearly all regulation applied to other media, and should it remains largely unaccountable to any elected power ?

So the challenge it seems is thus : how do preserve the good things that self published video content has done for us, but prevent or limit the consequences and attendant injustice caused by a service so infeasibly large. it's impossible to administer ?

Re: YouTube suspends account for linking to a PhD research on WPA2 vulnerability

#196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's an outdated view. Youtube now bends to activists and political winds.

So what is the activist political position on WPA2 vulnerabilities? You see what you want to see, but YouTube hosts an overwhelming abundance of evidence that contradicts your claim.

Internal employee pressure is the cause of some things getting removed, but they are not behind everything. In this particular case it might bdriven by legal concerns or something. But it should also be seen in light of the status quo. When censorship being the new default, then it doesn't take a strong reason to add another thing, such as hacking-adjacent content to the no-go pile. The code is already written, and the routines are well-known. There is no freedom-of-speech reputation left to protect. So the cost of removing this content is very low, lower than the legal risk.

Re: YouTube suspends account for linking to a PhD research on WPA2 vulnerability

#197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a "psyops", YouTube, like every gigantic corporation is motivated entirely by money, and they would be happy to monetize every video on the site if they could, but advertisers pay the bills, and since advertisers are sensitive to their public image, YouTube goes out of their way to appease them. The problem here is the ad model, not AI or YouTube's values.

That's an outdated view. Youtube now bends to activists and political winds.

IMO bending to activists and political winds is within the same realm of what OP mentioned. There is a LOT of money to be made by following the trends and in today's world, activism and politicizing is the name of the game.

Re: YouTube suspends account for linking to a PhD research on WPA2 vulnerability

#198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where are people escaping to? Are people publishing their own content on Gopher or BitTorrent nowadays? These platforms have a perfect balance of usability and freedom. They can take over the world.

It seems like they are making their own sites. Nebula is one such place where a few of the higher quality content creators are going. I've no idea if it'll work, but they are trying. https://watchnebula.com/

With a $5 monthly fee and no way to upload your own videos, Nebula is most directly competing against Netflix, not YouTube. A few top creators might be able to make that work, but most won't.

Re: YouTube suspends account for linking to a PhD research on WPA2 vulnerability

#199
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's basically what the author suggests when they say: > Anyhow, I truly believe humanity has to rollback to operating at a human scale. It's impossible to operate a complaints-platform on a global scale if it's run by humans. According to GMI [0], 500 hours of content are uploaded every minute. Given an average video duration of about 12 minutes [1], that would be 2500 videos per hour. That's just too much to manu…

I don't have any data to back this up, but i believe of those 2500 videos per minute, 2450 or so the AI could classify them as safe, not requiring human interaction. The other 50 are classified on a scale from 0 to 100 on a badness scale. The ones closer to "not that bad" (ToS and such) gets put through automatically waiting for a review. The illegal content (rape, gore, child porn) and such gets blocked automaticall…

I've thought that something like the spamassassin model would be sufficient - calculate a 0.0 - 1.0 range of likelihood to block, and set cutoffs on the 0 end to auto approve, and toward the 1 end to auto block, and moderate the middle.

Was good for spam for a long time.

Re: YouTube suspends account for linking to a PhD research on WPA2 vulnerability

#200
post #133

YouTube's content policy is bizare. Children in my family seem to watch videos of Spiderman dry humping Elsa or grannies kicking people in the nuts, but then they remove stuff like this. I guess this is what happens when advertisers are the main priority and the moderators have all been replaced with robots. Content that may actually harm the development of children is considered fine, while someone posting a slightl…

Knowing that that's what the kids are watching, why are you still allowing them to have access to YouTube?

i kind of get where you are coming from but denying access to knowledge/reality is not helpful.
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