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Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

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Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then can Etherium 2.0 get some love?

“Hey there, you love the rich getting richer and a perpetual level of Uber rich controlling the financial system that is unbreakable? Then you’re going to love proof of stake.”

Anyone can stake. Even if you don't have 32 ethers.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#343
post #3

Legitimizing Bitcoin more than offsets the environmental benefits of electric vehicles.

Bitcoin uses as much electricity as Chile and a single transaction has the same carbon footprint as ~700k Visa transactions. This may also be underestimated and account for around half of global data centre energy consumption as per a recent study. [1] [1] - https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption/

«as much electricity as Chile»

Or about as much as a single large hydroelectric dam.

Fun fact: many miners are located in places with cheap hydro/wind electricity like Sichuan & Yunnan provinces in China. These provinces abandon 100+ TWh/year of hydropower. They literally run water through the dams without powering the turbines. 100 TWh/year is more than what Bitcoin consumes globally.

«single transaction has the same carbon footprint as...»

Misleading. Bitcoin transactions don't consume mining energy. Mining power is completely independent of transaction volume.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#344
post #242

I bought $100 of BTC a while ago for fun. I watched it go up and down and mostly up. I got bored, and sold it for cash to donate... literally an hour before the big spike just earlier. I know about the fallacies of predicting the market. I understand 20/20 hindsight. But to actually experience it is such a strong lesson. To be flooded with, "ohhh I'm such an idiot!" and then think about how there's just no way I coul…

The thing I've learned investing so far: never sell anything . It really only ever makes sense to sell if doing so will positively change your lifestyle, or you have no alternative. Examples of when selling might be a good idea are buying a house, retiring, going through hard times, loss of a job etc. Rebalancing is fine too, but I'd personally only bother to do that if your portfolio is massively distorted (like it…

Noo, you should not hodl something forever just because you bought it and it's precious to you. The thing about investing and stock market in general is, that people are constantly seeking the _best_ returns. If you have invested in something and it goes up by 10% in a year while a similar asset goes up 50%, you should probably re-evaluate your investment.

I have noticed that companies and investments do roughly divide into winners and losers. Meaning a currently well-performing asset will do well in the future. And a badly performing asset will probably suck still years to come.

One of the best things in investing i have done is selling my badly performing assets and buying some over-priced but well-performing assets. Sometimes the price is worth the hype.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#345
post #3

Legitimizing Bitcoin more than offsets the environmental benefits of electric vehicles.

Eric Voskuil writes about the "energy" argument. All moneys can be compared on energy level, and it is important to note not to look at energy solely, but also labor, land, services, energy, hardware, and other resources needed to keep a system running. If you are comparing the coin to fiat, take into account the military industrial complex, the cost of physical bank branches, physical issue, the cost of seignorage on the money holder (i.e. gain of energy for those close to the printing press vs. loss of energy for existing holders).

If you rationally examine, the money holder will select the money with the least energy waste. All moneys not held imply a higher amount of energy inefficiency. This is why one may hold the USD, as opposed to the Turkish Lira. This is why one may hold btc, as opposed to the USD.

If you want to investigate a bit more in depth, cryptoeconomics Proof of Work fallacy is a great resource by Eric Voskuil.

Link: https://github.com/libbitcoin/libbitcoin-system/wiki/Proof-o....

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#346
post #161
post #3

Legitimizing Bitcoin more than offsets the environmental benefits of electric vehicles.

Are there any alternative to the Bitcoin?

Take your pick: https://coingecko.com

While many of these are forks of Bitcoin and use similarly wasteful proof mechanisms, many are also completely new and different. Several different consensus mechanisms are broadly used across these, most of which improve drastically on Bitcoins wasteful Proof of Work (PoW). Some even solve the problem with only very negligible energy footprint, such as the variations on Byzantine Fault Tolerance (BFT). It's been long-debated whether those alternatives trade safety for energy-savings, but after many years it would appear the reverse is true. The majority of projects that have succumbed to some kind of system-inherent weakness have been PoW protocols being "51% attacked", which is generally not a concern for the alternatives.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#347

Bitcoin is a mystery to me. Somehow it's hailed as revolutionising the economy, by replacing currency with a worse kind of currency. It feels like this is where all the "how to get rich quick" book writers and other hustle bros went and created one giant financial pyramid, which works in quite simple way: - buy bitcoin - tell everyone around how revolutionary it is, so they buy it and what you holding increases in va…

Bitcoin has revolutionized the black market economy.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#348
post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anyone can send or receive cryptocurrency without third party authorization.

Why would you want to though? It takes at least an hour to confirm (~6 blocks) without a third-party and the fees are getting super high (costs around $13.50 / 30624 satoshis per transaction to get reasonable transfer times). So unless you're transferring a large amount, you're better off using a third party that can just hold all the money and flip a bit in their database saying the money is moved.

Bitcoin takes an hour to confirm, there are other cryptocurrencies that take much less time.

Bitcoin also has the fee problem, and more recently Ethereum. Other cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin Cash with larger block sizes don't have the same transaction fee problems.

Cryptocurrencies are still relatively new. Most of the problems are being solved and the technologies are improving rapidly.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#349

Here is the key paragraph from todays 10k. It also mentions gold related assets. ( https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1318605/000156459021... ): "In January 2021, we updated our investment policy to provide us with more flexibility to further diversify and maximize returns on our cash that is not required to maintain adequate operating liquidity. As part of the policy, which was duly approved by the Audit Commit…

You’ll notice that even if they accept Bitcoin as payment, they’ll never price anything in Bitcoin. Nobody does that. They always price it in dollars and accept Bitcoin at the market rate.

When people start pricing things I’m Bitcoin without doing some daily calculation, that’s when you know it’s serious.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin miners use surplus energy in remote places with lots of thermal or hydroelectric power. Remote China and Iceland. This electricity often can't be put to any other use anyway. The price of energy is probably enough to ensure this. Besides, the cost of maintaining Bitcoin has to be compared with holding up a fiat currency empire like the US. This requires lots of military, suppression of democracy and generally…

> This electricity often can't be put to any other use anyway. This is false. If there is surplus electricity, prices would drop, and you could expand availability. Government, especially the Chinese government is more than capable of shaping market demand. Furthermore, you could displace existing coal based electrical demand in the country. The value of currency comes from trust that you manage it well, not from the…

In Europe where I live, electricity costs 0.06 euro for generation and then 0.25 on top for transportation to me. So eve if the grid is vast, transport costs are vast as well.
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