Live data from Hacker News

Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

techcrunch.com

211–220 of 1001 posts

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#211
post #161
post #3

Legitimizing Bitcoin more than offsets the environmental benefits of electric vehicles.

Are there any alternative to the Bitcoin?

Depends on the use case. If you want to pay anonymously online then there is Paysafecard for example (available in some countries and for some services).

There are other blockchain currencies of course, but I think they all have the same environmental issues.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#212
post #164
post #77

2020 has completely changed my perception of Tesla and Musk. I had this image of a benevolent genius who is sometimes misunderstood ("funding secured", "pedo guy", "Autopilot"). Came across Teslacharts' podcast [1] (now the Chartcast) and oh boy was I wrong. This is only the latest in a long series of red flags around Tesla/Musk and however it ends, it will not end well. [1] https://thechartcast.com/

If he succeeds with SpaceX, I don't care if he's a lunatic. We must have a frontier. Also: The last round of space innovation was funded by two nuclear armed superpowers competing to show off while simultaneously threatening each other with a war of planetary annihilation. Before that the first rocket capable of reaching space was funded by Hitler. Going from blood soaked warlords to nutty manic billionaires is moral…

> We must have a frontier?

Why?

Who is “we”?

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#213
Can't bitcoin addresses be blacklisted? [0] Since mining is laregly controlled by the Chinese these days isn't everyone taking a massive risk of not being able to move their money out?

[0] https://www.coindesk.com/us-treasury-department-blacklists-2...

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#214
post #130
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get similar vibes from these events, even though I am a cryptocurrency optimist (including Bitcoin).

Is an optimist one that thinks it will stay around, or one that thinks it will go away?

One that thinks that they will be around and be progressively more integrated in the fabric of society. I think crypto assets and blockchains have the potential to scale societal institutions and trust relationships in a way that was not possible before. Anything that requires consensus and governance can be implemented in a more transparent and trustworthy way on top of crypto asset networks. But some parts of the puzzle are not there yet. Most importantly, we need better ways for people to be able to manage cryptographic keys. Devices like Ledger or Trezor are good but they need to get even better.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#215

I don't understand all the Crypto hate on this site. Since when have hackers become the luddites to new ways of finance?

Cryptos are purely a speculation vessel, they don't fix many of the problems they claim to fix and add tons of problems over other currencies I'm fine with cryptos as long as they're not pitched as something they're not

This is my biggest “problem” with crypto. I actually think it’s neat in theory, but it’s the disconnect between what they say and what they do that makes my brain itch.

It’s like when a function’s documentation says “returns a tuple with three elements” but looking at the source it only returns a tuple with two elements.

My tech survival skills help me avoid things where what people say is different than what they’re doing. And saying that crypto is about storing value and transactions and smart contracts and then designing it specifically to award speculators is dissonance.

I’ve seen lots of architects and programmers try to back into design decisions with flimsy reasons to just not bother with it.

I’ve been waiting it to shake out as it will be really cool to have digital currency and smart contracts.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#216
post #77

2020 has completely changed my perception of Tesla and Musk. I had this image of a benevolent genius who is sometimes misunderstood ("funding secured", "pedo guy", "Autopilot"). Came across Teslacharts' podcast [1] (now the Chartcast) and oh boy was I wrong. This is only the latest in a long series of red flags around Tesla/Musk and however it ends, it will not end well. [1] https://thechartcast.com/

Please do not leave comments like this without _some_ elaboration. Linking to a one hour long podcast is not sufficient, especially without so much as a timestamp.

Indeed. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandolini%27s_law

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sagan_standard

I've been beginning to wonder for a few years now if there's a fatal flaw in the scientific method in that, at some point, giving proper validation to a piece of information or claimed knowledge becomes so resource intensive that it becomes cost prohibitive in time, energy, capital, etc. to validate or invalidate.

In fact, I've been wondering if science itself can get to a point where the body of human knowledge becomes so large that even the typical process of conducting a literature review becomes so costly in some form, you're better off just to do the experiment, study, or whatever. There may be some benefit in this allowing independent consensus of knowledge but you ultimately need some sort if more refined knowledge management system.

The society we live in of self-interest perpetuating disinformation and misinformation for personal interest sort of brings this issue on extreme. If you've ever seen absurd claims and wanted to earnestly validate or show how a claim is off, you've experienced this. You can not only make absurd claims now, you can often provide massive bodies of supposed evidence that are difficult if not impossible to tell what is accurate or inaccurate.

It's not only enough to provide extraordinary evidence for extraordinary claims, you need to provide focused evidence or evidence that can be reasonably independently validated.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#217

Aside from all environment and ethical concerns, can someone elaborate how bitcoin & other crypto affects global economy and especially wealth equality? Since bitcoin transactions are anonymous, what will happen to taxes?

It's not anonymous. Very far from it actually.

Let's say you buy BTC on some exchange platform and then you buy something illegal with it from some FBI honeypot. FBI can trace where you get those bitcoins and then they can go to the exchange platform with a warrant (probably they don't need it nowadays) to extract your real identity.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#218
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index gives a much higher estimate (78 TWh vs. 117 TWh), which makes it about the same as the annual electricity usage of United Arab Emirates (pop. 9.9 million). https://www.cbeci.org/

It seems really weird to compare the energy consumption to that of a country. "The total energy usage for the production of cars/yachts/fitness machines/musical instruments/toilets equals that of country X" What does it even mean? How do you interpret it? It seems more sensible to compare to total worldwide energy consumption of which Bitcoin takes roughly 0.05%

Because you’re comparing the energy consumption of this one thing to the total energy consumption of $x million households along with all the country’s local industry to say that Bitcoin isn’t worth that cost compared to an alternative that requires trusted parties but uses orders of magnitude less energy.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#219
post #3

Legitimizing Bitcoin more than offsets the environmental benefits of electric vehicles.

Bitcoin miners use surplus energy in remote places with lots of thermal or hydroelectric power. Remote China and Iceland. This electricity often can't be put to any other use anyway. The price of energy is probably enough to ensure this.

Besides, the cost of maintaining Bitcoin has to be compared with holding up a fiat currency empire like the US. This requires lots of military, suppression of democracy and generally violence. Seen through that lense it might be quite cheap.

Re: Tesla buys $1.5B in Bitcoin, may accept it as payment in the future

#220
post #3

Legitimizing Bitcoin more than offsets the environmental benefits of electric vehicles.

Our biggest environmental footprints as individuals are heating and cooling. Having an electric car is nothing compared to it. Take one intercontinental flight and again, having a fossil fuel car for a year does not exceed the emissions of that flight. http://www.withouthotair.com/ Legitimizing Bitcoin has nothing to do with the environment in the large scale of things. It's like saying that you need to optimize fast…

> Our biggest environmental footprints as individuals are heating and cooling. Having an electric car is nothing compared to it.

Isn't Tesla aiming to electrify everything and then use clean energy as the source of the electricity? At the moment running heating or cooling should be clean as long as the energy is coming from a renewable source, right?

> Take one intercontinental flight and again, having a fossil fuel car for a year does not exceed the emissions of that flight.

For the entire flight, right? I would be curious how much driving one seat on a flight equates to. I presume flying is at least better than driving on a per-mile basis?

Post reply on HN