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Capitol Attack Was Months in the Making on Facebook

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Re: Capitol Attack Was Months in the Making on Facebook

#641

Post by NewOrderNow »

King-Aaron wrote: post #437
nostromo wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rush to call the storming of the capitol terrorism is really misplaced. By adopting words like "terrorism" you're paving the way for an overreaching response from lawmakers and law enforcement -- something that will likely end up being used against a cause you might support, like BLM. Firstly, nobody was terrorized. No, this wasn't "our 9/11." I doubt it'll even be a topic of conversation in a few years, just lik…

I'm deeply saddened to see so many people on Hacker News trying so hard to downplay this.

Hyperbole harry over here

Re: Capitol Attack Was Months in the Making on Facebook

#642

Post by wdn »

Railsify wrote: post #540
asdfk-12 wrote: post #438

Half of a billion in lobbying dollars well spent by FAANG[1] - business as usual continues for facebook despite their decreasing popularity and repeated scandal and failure, from Cambridge Analytica to Libra. Those in my immediate circle have mothballed or closed their accounts, although Instagram seems to have more holding power. 1: https://www.forbes.com/sites/ajdellinger/2019/04/30/how-the-...

Members of Congress will use this event as a catalyst for fundraising, soon after the election they will draft legislation that threatens to control and/or regulate the tech giants. Shortly after that the lobbyists representing Big Tech get wind of this new legislation on the horizon and donations will flow like a river to the PACs and re-election campaigns, then the proposed legislation will be shelved.

If you see how much wealth the politicians, especially the one holding important position, you see why they want the job for a merely $200,000 a year.

Clinton and Obama got very wealth after their presidency. Pelosi wealth goes up many fold for becoming speaker of the house. Not only their wealth go up, everyone around them got a lot wealthier too.

Re: Capitol Attack Was Months in the Making on Facebook

#644

Post by CivBase »

tw04 wrote: post #594
Red_Tarsius wrote: post #112

>The Capitol Attack Where was this rhetoric when Antifa and BLM burned and looted for months with the blessings of all corporations and the mainstream media? Surely the Capitol Hill has an insurance policy? Or does that moronic point only apply to the common folk? Susan Rosenberg literally bombed the Capitol in 1983 and now serves as vice chair of the board of directors of Thousand Currents, a " non-profit foundation…

>Where was this rhetoric when Antifa and BLM burned and looted for months with the blessings of all corporations and the mainstream media? Surely the Capitol Hill has an insurance policy? Or does that moronic point only apply to the common folk? Blessing? The blessing was for peaceful protests, the rioters were universally condemned. >Susan Rosenberg literally bombed the Capitol in 1983 and now serves as vice chair o…

> The blessing was for peaceful protests, the rioters were universally condemned.

I know many people who defended the BLM rioters on social media. The actual rioters - not just the protesters.

Re: Capitol Attack Was Months in the Making on Facebook

#645

Post by rj_kidwin »

dylan-m wrote: post #137
Red_Tarsius wrote: post #112

>The Capitol Attack Where was this rhetoric when Antifa and BLM burned and looted for months with the blessings of all corporations and the mainstream media? Surely the Capitol Hill has an insurance policy? Or does that moronic point only apply to the common folk? Susan Rosenberg literally bombed the Capitol in 1983 and now serves as vice chair of the board of directors of Thousand Currents, a " non-profit foundation…

- The BLM movement is, while poorly framed and easily co-opted by other people, about genuine problems with policing in the United States. Problems that are backed up with verifiable facts rather than scummy used car salesmen and the Inventor of Email™. - The BLM movement, while the source of many large large scale protests (several of which turned into riots and outstayed their welcome) never, at any point, even pre…

According to The Washington Post, 19 unarmed black men were killed by police in the entirety of 2019. Black people are disproportionately killed by police for their population, but almost exactly in proportion to the rate of violent crime broken down by race.

Obviously every "unjustified" death, especially deaths by the police (who are trained and held to higher expectations given their position) is a tragedy. The riots and protests led to far more deaths, far more injuries, and far more damage (including causing the second wave as cases were decreasing) than seems at all justified even considering these tragic police shootings.

In other words, while police brutality is a genuine problem, the response was completely disproportionate, misinformed, and morally wrong.

Re: Capitol Attack Was Months in the Making on Facebook

#646

Post by rj_kidwin »

mrburkins wrote: post #640
vimy wrote: post #522

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So, the original idea there is police in the United States are killing black people for stupid reasons, which is true. Is it though? Seems to me you're advocating feelings matter more than facts. I believe it would be more accurate to say "police in the United States are killing people for stupid reasons, which is true." while keeping in mind that those incidents are the exception, not the norm. The police shot 28 u…

I think the issue isn’t just police killing unarmed black people but also an incredibly large disparity in use of all physical force which your stats allude to: >This paper explores racial differences in police use of force. On non-lethal uses of force, blacks and Hispanics are more than fifty percent more likely to experience some form of force in interactions with police. Adding controls that account for important…

Further down in their comment they cite statistics about variant violent crime rates by race, where African Americans commit more than 50% of violent crime, which seems in line with your cited non-lethal force rates. Violent criminals receiving proportionate rates of violent force doesn't stand out as a disparity.

Re: Capitol Attack Was Months in the Making on Facebook

#647

Post by dionian »

zarkov99 wrote: post #338
jjoonathan wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On one hand we have hooligans using a crowd as cover to get away with property damage. On the other we have hooligans organized for the express purpose of overturning the results of a democratic election. In the case of BLM, the crimes don't reflect on the movement's overall purpose. Nobody expects property damage to be a vehicle for police reform -- it's an argument for more police presence, if anything. In the case…

What would you call the Capital Hill Autonomous Zone if not an attempt at insurrection? Come on, can we have some intellectual honesty here? Both situations sucked, the people involved sucked, their reasoning sucked and they should all go to jail so that sane people can get back to their lives in peace. We are being forced into building absurd logical houses of cards just so we do not concede an inch to the other sid…

Unlike the Capitol Hill issue, the ChaZ people actually had guns, and shooting deaths there (and not shootings by cops).

Re: Capitol Attack Was Months in the Making on Facebook

#648

Post by toofy »

King-Aaron wrote: post #437
nostromo wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rush to call the storming of the capitol terrorism is really misplaced. By adopting words like "terrorism" you're paving the way for an overreaching response from lawmakers and law enforcement -- something that will likely end up being used against a cause you might support, like BLM. Firstly, nobody was terrorized. No, this wasn't "our 9/11." I doubt it'll even be a topic of conversation in a few years, just lik…

I'm deeply saddened to see so many people on Hacker News trying so hard to downplay this.

the same people have been denying this problem for the past few years. they’ve been constantly either changing the subject or denying that the problem exists at all. mass shootings? oh no big deal. a newsroom was shot up? oh no big deal. bombs sent to every democrat leader, cnn, soros, etc..? oh don’t discuss that, discuss this instead! obvious signs of misinformation and propaganda spreading like a virus through internet forums? oh that’s not anything to worry about.

Re: Capitol Attack Was Months in the Making on Facebook

#649

Post by esperent »

throwaway316943 wrote: post #503
airstrike wrote: post #464

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Terrorism is committing violent acts targeting non-combatants for political goals

That’s a bit loose. Terrorism aims to inspire terror, those violent acts have to be extreme and indiscriminate to do so.

For example, missiles from unmanned drones hitting civilian targets like schools and hospitals.

Note the statistics here [0] - of course the numbers are very fuzzy but at the worst case scenario it's 1:2.5 civilians: military targets. So for every 2.5 military targets, 1 civilian. That fits the bill for extreme and indiscriminate.

[0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drone_strikes_in_Pakistan

Re: Capitol Attack Was Months in the Making on Facebook

#650

Post by belorn »

jacquesm wrote: post #511
nostromo wrote: post #435

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What they can't survive is... And yet, here we are, democracy intact.

There was an excellent article by someone from a place where a failed coup led to a real one a couple of years hence. Democracy is not 'intact', it is now damaged, and whether or not manage to repair it remains to be seen. The most dangerous thing you can do now is to think this is behind you and from here on in everything is normal. It isn't and it probably won't be for some time. If you manage the next two transfer…

I would like to see some data on failed coups that does not involve any military.

The latest major failed coup that I can remember would be the 2016 Turkish coup d'état attempt, and the effect it had on the country is well known. The general consensus internationally seems to be that the efforts by their government to stamp out their "terrorists" has been a bit of an overreaction, even if literal tanks was involved. The censorship machine in particular has been quite overreactive.

One can really hope that the US democracy manage a more appropriate reaction that is more proportional to the threat.

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