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Who Were America’s Enslaved? New Database Humanizes the Names Behind the Numbers

smithsonianmag.com

131–140 of 194 posts

Re: Who Were America’s Enslaved? New Database Humanizes the Names Behind the Numbers

#131
post #64

I have a pretty good idea, its about investing in Africa. America has a lot of assets, in the black population, they should encourage people to visit their homeland, on a paid trip. Helping the African economy and helping African Americans create business connects to Africa. Then there should be a programme where African Americans get a lump sum, if they start a business or invest in land in Africa. France is doing s…

Would you say that white Americans homeland is Europe? Most of African Europeans a)know what country their ancestors are from, b) have direct links to their relatives in Africa. > Africa has a lot of future, plenty of growth. China knows this and has invested a lot into Africa. I think this is exactly Africa's main issue: being seen first foremost as a land of resources and economic ventures. You go to the Americas/E…

> Would you say that white Americans homeland is Europe?

I would say — from a European perspective — a baffling number of white Americans cling on to a European cultural identity. It feels to an outsider like many Americans want to be American + something else. Many/most black Americans don’t have this luxury, and my hot take is that Kwanza and other pan-African neo traditions seek to fill this gap? As a counter-example, I lived in the anglophone Caribbean for many years, and it always felt like there was a strong sense of national identity there, very distinct from trying to associate with Africa in any way. I guess I’d also expect 2nd/3rd generation African immigrants to America to maintain their cultural identity — I don’t think I’ve ever heard someone with Ethiopian heritage describe themselves as anything other than Ethiopian whatever their passport or recent ancestry

Re: Who Were America’s Enslaved? New Database Humanizes the Names Behind the Numbers

#132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can be done indirectly. Fund infrastructure that is needed for housing starts, do other things to remove obstacles to housing starts, etc.

Probably would not end well. https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/collins-v-mnuchi...

Why are we talking about Fannie and Freddie? They are direct subsidies!

I'm talking about building power lines and wastewater plants and shit like that. Encouraging counties to adopt zoning that simplifies residential construction. Etc.

Re: Who Were America’s Enslaved? New Database Humanizes the Names Behind the Numbers

#133
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did they arrive after redlining ended, early in the 1970s?

This seems like a huge stretch and reeks of taking a tortured argument one major leap too far. How many people in society 1) were in a position to redline or seriously influence redlining, 2) called for and actively supported it, or 3) even knew about it? Even if someone's ancestors arrived post-slavery and pre-civil rights movement (forget a specific overhanging issue like redlining), would you significantly attribu…

I don't understand the question. The socioeconomic structure of many of our largest cities is defined by redlining. Lawndale and Englewood in Chicago? Entirely the product of redlining. The property values of houses in areas cordoned off for white people? Redlining.

Re: Who Were America’s Enslaved? New Database Humanizes the Names Behind the Numbers

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you accept fault for the atrocities committed to Native Americans? Why aren’t you paying them reparations, too? And while we are at it, what about the descendants of the Japanese Americans who were imprisoned during World War 2 in Colorado and other states? What about the children who worked in sweat shops and coal mines during the 19th and early 20th centuries, many of whom died young? Their relatives should be c…

> I can go on and on and our country will be bankrupt before we’re done. Isn't that a shame, well at least we could then hold our heads high. > But hey, at least you’ve taken responsibility for the actions of others. The title is encumbered. For the same reason that laundering money doesn't make the original theft disappear, its not ethical or moral to benefit financially from atrocities then launder the money and pr…

> Isn't that a shame, well at least we could then hold our heads high.

I already do.

Re: Who Were America’s Enslaved? New Database Humanizes the Names Behind the Numbers

#135
Often in histories of slavery, the slaves don't speak. If you want to hear their voices, read "Slave Testimony," edited by John Blassingame. It's stunning in length and detail. Not all suffered the same slavery we know today.

This passage is by an enslaved (interviewed by the American Freedmen's Inquiry Commission) in Kentucky, 1963, named Charlotte "I belong to Gen. Thos. Strange. I have two boys. I pay a dollar a week to him, and support myself and children, and pay my house rent. I have been hiring myself for over fifteen years; I get along very well, and keep the hire paid up. You couldn't pay me to live at home, if I could help myself. My master doesn't supply me with anything -- not even a little medicine -- no more than if I didn't belong to him. Each of my children pays him $2.00 a week. They work in tobacconist shops. I support them. One of my boys is thirteen years old and the other seventeen. They get $2 a week pay. If the boys make more than $2 a week a piece I get what is over; if they don't make that, I have to make it good to him. He has got to have it Saturday night, sure. I have not had good health. Sometimes I am ailing, but I always keep up enough to try to make my wages. I have only one room, and pay three dollars a month for it. I live by washing."

Re: Who Were America’s Enslaved? New Database Humanizes the Names Behind the Numbers

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can go on and on and our country will be bankrupt before we’re done. Isn't that a shame, well at least we could then hold our heads high. > But hey, at least you’ve taken responsibility for the actions of others. The title is encumbered. For the same reason that laundering money doesn't make the original theft disappear, its not ethical or moral to benefit financially from atrocities then launder the money and pr…

> Isn't that a shame, well at least we could then hold our heads high. I already do.

The case for reparations is not based on ancestral guilt, but on historical crimes that were sanctioned by governments that are still in power.

Re: Who Were America’s Enslaved? New Database Humanizes the Names Behind the Numbers

#137
post #3

In a similar vein, George Washington’s Mount Vernon estate - today privately owned and operated as a living history museum - has an excellent series of exhibits which puts names and stories to the Washington family’s enslaved servants and laborers: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/groundbreaking-exhibi... The re-enactors are all fantastic and very knowledgeable. It’s unsettling talking to a black re-enactor who…

Washington is always the one that gets me. His will freed his slaves not when he died but when his wife died. So he knew what was right but intentionally allowed that only after he could be assured it wouldn't cause any hardship to him or his spouse. That feels more evil then just being a creature of the time. That's knowing better but making a conscious decision to embrace evil because it makes your life easier.

Re: Who Were America’s Enslaved? New Database Humanizes the Names Behind the Numbers

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As soon as those claims are paid, the floodgates will open and you can’t say “no” to others when you’ve said “yes” to the first because... racism.

> As soon as those claims are paid, the floodgates will open and you can’t say “no” to others when you’ve said “yes” to the first "yes we can" -US President Barack Obama

Yes, YOU can. Give your funds to such causes. Not me and not my government.

Re: Who Were America’s Enslaved? New Database Humanizes the Names Behind the Numbers

#139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’m an immigrant, and I’ll never stand for any kind of reparations for descendants of former slaves. Invariably this will come out of tax dollars to which I’m contributing by way of income tax. Why should I be charged for wrongs - however horrible - in which neither myself nor my ancestors were involved? Why should you be a contributor to the wrongs of this country's past? Simple, because you are a member/resident…

Slavery was not in the least a contribution to "financial success". It was very much a dysfunctional and failing system, for reasons that were made clear even by Adam Smith, who wrote in 1776 - and that are agreed upon by modern economists. What it did was create a huge unfair advantage for the few who could afford to "own" someone who had been enslaved - but that never translated to region-wide progress. Indeed, the…

I don't think that interpretation of history is quite so strong, for a few reasons. While buying enough slaves to run a plantation was extremely expensive - buying a single slave to have for household purposes was not unobtainable or rare at all. Since slave status was inherited and the "one-drop" rule ensured it tended to get inherited, it was extremely common for less-financially well-off slave owners to simply rape an enslaved woman (multiple times over her lifetime) and then to either sell his mixed children, or commonly - to gift them as slaves to his white children when they come of age. This is a hugely valuable financial advantage for those who inherit a slave, and having a slave made them more valuable as a spouse as well, meaning they could increase their wealth more by marrying better than they could have without a slave. Nearly every white person from the south, has a family member who owned a slave - even if you would never guess by their economic status today. I'm from the south myself, and even though my great-grandparents were dirt poor in the mountains, I don't doubt someone somewhere back in time owned a slave. It really was just so common that the probability is a near certainty.

Also, when slavery was at it's height, Virginia, South Carolina, and Georgia were far more prosperous regions than they eventually became post-civil war. The south in general was more financially well-off during the time of slavery than it has been since - and you can read primary sources from the time and region saying as much. I can point you towards primary sources from elected officials of the time period saying as much - that they knew slavery was evil, but they also knew it was the source of economic and social stability that they enjoyed. The institution of slavery itself did not directly lead to economic fall of the southern states - rather it was the tensions from having a nation with both slaveholding states and non-slaveholding states, and the south's extremely strong incentive to protect their advantageous status even at the cost of war.

When the war did happen, the civil-war-related destruction that happened in the south (ie, the burning of Atlanta), had an equally dramatic impact and the outcome that we see today. Decades of slavery were certainly impactful, but so were the effects of the civil war, reconstruction, the great migration, and later cycles of industrialization, which tended to reach the south last due to network effects (there was no impetus to branch out from the skilled workers available up north... until unions took hold at least). All of those effects are more recent, and more relevant to the economic conditions today.

Additionally, the cultural regressiveness you speak of is closely tied to the Great Awakening and the particularly conservative religious denominations that became regionally dominant - and notably, these denominations had, and still have strong pull on southern white and black communities alike. The south actually had a reputation for being quite a fun and "sinful" place before that. My own state, NC, founded the first public university in the world (UNC Chapel Hill) - a paradoxically very progressive institution - despite being founded by slavers during a period of widespread slavery.

So understanding inequality and culture that exists in South, both now and then, and today is a complex thing. I would strongly caution trying to reduce it down that completely.

Re: Who Were America’s Enslaved? New Database Humanizes the Names Behind the Numbers

#140
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? I think the resistance to reparations comes from folks like me who don't see a reason we should pay anything. Most of my ancestors are German immigrants to the northeast US who arrived after slavery was abolished. The remainder were poor Scotts Irish who continued to live in poverty in northern Appalachia. I understand, but do not agree with, the logical hoops many jump through to justify indebtedness to all…

> direct reparations are the best approach to resolving the continuing racism in America This conflates two separate issues. One is about a financial debt owed to people. This is owed for forced labor and land thefts which continued into the 20th century. Like the OP said, for the most part this is well documented. Debts are repaid in cash or like goods. Racism is a separate topic, which I agree should be approached…

What about the treaties we broke with Native Americans, stealing their land after we agreed they could have it in perpetuity? This happened dozens of times in different parts of the country.

Do we repay them as well? And how many trillions (since that’s there value of such land now, with or without interest)

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