91–100 of 225 posts
Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think the cost of an engineer is way less than 80K in India. Here in the Netherlands a senior SE would be $80K. I see no reason to go to India instead of western Europe then.
At least in Germany, $80k salary would mean costs of nearly $100k for the employer because of additional social security payments required. So it really isn't a fair comparison.
I don't think moving tech labor form US workers to Indian workers will have the desired effect that corporate decision makers are hoping for. For one, good tech workers are hard to find anywhere. A candidate needs a range of attributes to be effective at this type of work. That type of talent is hard enough to find in the western world, it will likely be just as hard to find in the east. Two, Indian tech labor isn't…
My feeling is that best Indian software engineers are in the US (or even Europe) already. I have great Indian and Pakistani colleagues at my company, but we had very mixed results with outsourcing.
It's hard to ignore the siren song as a business person of comparing your 300k a year engineers to a senior engineer that costs $80k in India (regardless of the potential hidden costs of cultural and time zone differences). This gap should probably narrow as more remote work becomes normal, and more people move out of the Valley and can actually live decently on 150k, rather than 300k.
You can live decently in the valley on a lot less than 300k. Speaking from experience, even 90k is perfectly comfortable. Based on the salaries of my friends in SF, $150k is a very reasonable salary that allows a fantastic lifestyle.
No, maybe you aren't going to $100/plate restaurants every night or living in a $5000/month luxury studio, but there are plenty of great apartments in Oakland (where I live) for $1500-2000/month.
What's actually started to become jarring is the difference between SF proper and the rest of the region. SF rents seem to be almost 2x comparable places in the East Bay, plus the general price level is higher from Prop C and all the other insane junk the electorate wants. 2x the cost and the city is rapidly becoming a tent camp, I'm happy to live a little farther out and commute to work 1-2x/week when I'm not WFH.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
At least in Germany, $80k salary would mean costs of nearly $100k for the employer because of additional social security payments required. So it really isn't a fair comparison.
Would that translate into a "40k in your pocket" salary? I have heard Germans mention 50% tax before, but no idea how it is implemented.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why should those engineers be paid $150k if they're generating more than $300k of value? For that matter, why should an Indian engineer be paid $80k if they're generating $300k of value minus whatever hidden costs you want to assign (surely not $220k)?
People are paid based on how much a similarly skilled worker is willing to work for, not based on how much value they generate for a company.
I used to think this was a bad thing, but these days I'm not so sure. Assuming you can get the same (or similar) talent in India instead of the US, doesn't it make sense to do your development in a place where your money goes farther? The capitalist in me sees this as a win: more value for shareholders, and a big life improvement for Indians. Can someone explain to me why it's a bad thing? I understand it might be ba…
There are plenty of devs outside of Silicon Valley. They don't have to look halfway across the world to reduce their costs.
Are those devs currently unemployed and waiting for the phone to ring? If they're going to be headhunted out of the current jobs they'll have to make it worth their while. Conversely their current employers may make them counter-offers. The end result being that overall cost of hiring that person can be significantly higher than initially anticipated. If there was an abundant supply of potential workers the wages would face a natural downward pressure. Even in Silicon Valley...
It's hard to ignore the siren song as a business person of comparing your 300k a year engineers to a senior engineer that costs $80k in India (regardless of the potential hidden costs of cultural and time zone differences). This gap should probably narrow as more remote work becomes normal, and more people move out of the Valley and can actually live decently on 150k, rather than 300k.
The gap is a function of Moore's Law. If Moore's Law slows down, the gap will narrow. If not, then not.
It's hard to ignore the siren song as a business person of comparing your 300k a year engineers to a senior engineer that costs $80k in India (regardless of the potential hidden costs of cultural and time zone differences). This gap should probably narrow as more remote work becomes normal, and more people move out of the Valley and can actually live decently on 150k, rather than 300k.
Yes, the salaries I've seen bandied about for SV developers are absurd. That a new grad in SV can out-earn a seasoned dev located elsewhere was never sustainable. People will point out that the rent is absurdly high too, and maybe it is, but I'd also wager that these employees are renting from colleagues higher up who approve these salaries because they know they'll get a large cut.