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US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

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Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#191

Post by virmundi »

ntsplnkv2 wrote: post #170
nightski wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am from the area and I agree wholeheartedly that people > property. But let's be real, we saw a 182 unit multi story low income housing unit burn down to ash (the blaze was enormous). We also saw a police department building burn to ash. Countless local businesses have been completely destroyed by fire. That's a little more than spray paint and tv looting.

I find it funny that we expect black Americans to peacefully protest. "Please use this system of peaceful protest that hasn't worked for you since forever." LA was 92, we're almost 30 years to the year. Has anything changed? Do you tell HK protestors to write a letter to the CCP instead? It's such a double-standard.

Have the blacks voted out those in power and positions to change things? Nope. Democrats all the way. Hell, Biden said if you’re black and you vote anything other than Democrat, you ain’t black.

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#192

Post by mnm1 »

joshmn wrote: post #3

Native Minnesotan here — living in Minneapolis — that has lived on both coasts: With all that's happening the last few days, please don't generally associate Minnesotans with the violent riots that have captured the attention of everyone. The peacefulness of the protests and gatherings has been overshadowed by the violence. There are countless examples of Minnesotans standing up to those who choose to loot and destro…

The people rioting generally seem like decent people standing up for a just cause. So no, we won't judge all Minnesotans the same way. We will judge the people who set things up so that this is a common occurrence much more harshly. And that includes most Minnesotans. But don't worry. That includes most Americans. We'll judge them all for the shitty society they created where cops can beat and murder innocent people and get away with it. And we'll especially judge the cops, all of them, for murdering, stealing, assaulting, and supporting their fellow officers in the commission of such crimes. People are not innocent simply because they are nonviolent when they fully support the violence of police.

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#193

Post by klyrs »

lm28469 wrote: post #119
wafn wrote: post #35

Pretty sure there are laws against mass arson, looting, rioting, vandalism, etc. so if the people can't follow laws why should the government?

> if the people can't follow laws why should the government? Damn, this should be framed.

Has this not already replaced "serve and protect"?

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#194

Post by JumpCrisscross »

remarkEon wrote: post #111
pm90 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fellow HN user, I welcome you with warmth so please don't take what I say offensively, but as a different perspective. > What happened is awful. It doesn't reflect how genuinely kind people in Minnesota are and how we, collectively feel about what happened and the movement at large. There will always be edge-cases as there is with any situation in any context. But for everyone that I've known, for everyone I've met a…

Another fellow Minnesotan here and former Minneapolis resident (used to live a mile away from Hiawatha and Lake back in the day). >Characterizing what is happening as an edge case is a huge mistake. People do not spontaneously start protesting with so much anger if it hasn't built up over so long. These protests are at least partly drummed up by out of state agitators, and are implicitly condoned by a feckless and we…

> These protests are at least partly drummed up by out of state agitators

This is a scary response. We saw, today, a black CNN reporter arrested by state police on live television. If that’s how an educated, gently-speaking, Constitutionally-protected member of the press is treated, there is a root issue festering. Blaming it on agitators deflects from introspection.

A big part of the problem is Minneapolis’s moderates have turned a blind eye to the problems in their police force for years. That civic neglect has consequences. Those consequences are coming home to roost.

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#195

Post by vecter »

mywittyname wrote: post #168
new_realist wrote: post #154

Surveillance of the police by the public is good, police body cams are good, but airborne public surveillance of everyone is bad? If so, why?

People shouldn't be surveilled by the government without probable cause.

I'm 100% in favor of the protestors' cause, but if you want probable cause, burning down a police station, housing unit, and nearby businesses certainly qualifies.

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#196

Post by [deleted] »

meragrin_ wrote: post #121
dv_dt wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps this is too political, but the only tool they actually needed was one they had the whole time. Charge the offices based upon the evidence and open a more detailed investigation. The military equipment was entirely unnecessary - but it's very availability makes opportunity for bad decisions.

In all probability, union rules stand in the way of making any quick arrests. Their hands are tied. It is better for them to appear slow and do things by the book than try to appease the irrational mob. They'll eventually get to where the mob wants to go rather than ending up with the cops "winning" in some way due violations of union rules and procedures.

[deleted]

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#197

Post by testbot123 »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #186
testbot123 wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen’s Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to “order” than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a p…

MLK wasn't talking about rioting.

Not in /Letter from a Birmingham Jail/ (1963), but he would later go on to state the following (1967):

"Let me say as I've always said, and I will always continue to say, that riots are socially destructive and self-defeating. ... But in the final analysis, a riot is the language of the unheard. And what is it that America has failed to hear? It has failed to hear that the plight of the Negro poor has worsened over the last few years. It has failed to hear that the promises of freedom and justice have not been met. And it has failed to hear that large segments of white society are more concerned about tranquility and the status quo than about justice, equality, and humanity. And so in a real sense our nation's summers of riots are caused by our nation's winters of delay. And as long as America postpones justice, we stand in the position of having these recurrences of violence and riots over and over again."

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#198

Post by luckylion »

HarryHirsch wrote: post #138
meragrin_ wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In all probability, union rules stand in the way of making any quick arrests. Their hands are tied. It is better for them to appear slow and do things by the book than try to appease the irrational mob. They'll eventually get to where the mob wants to go rather than ending up with the cops "winning" in some way due violations of union rules and procedures.

It's hard to see why union rules would trump criminal procedure - if that were true the cops would really be a law above the law. You'd think the much delayed arrest was so that the suspects had time to scrub social media, get rid of Nazi paraphernalia, get their stories straight, that kind of thing. They can't get their fellow officers in trouble, that's part of their code.

Or, hear me out, the "delayed" arrests are so they don't make mistakes that would result in a mistrial because they don't want you to jump up and yell "they intentionally violated their rights so the judge would throw the case out".

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#199

Post by petre »

nightski wrote: post #139
dvdhnt wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surely, you aren't comparing mass murder, likely an international crime, to spray painting a building or stealing a TV? Property != people. People > property. Period. Nothing else to consider. Additionally, it's fairly common for security forces to instigate criminal behavior during protests in order to justify the extreme measures they use to suppress those protests.

I am from the area and I agree wholeheartedly that people > property. But let's be real, we saw a 182 unit multi story low income housing unit burn down to ash (the blaze was enormous). We also saw a police department building burn to ash. Countless local businesses have been completely destroyed by fire. That's a little more than spray paint and tv looting.

Perhaps your police should stop accidentally killing persons of colour then. Flying military drones over the city isn't going to de-escalate the situation. Properly punishing police brutality is.

Re: US customs and border protection is flying a surveillance drone over Minneapolis

#200

Post by ianleeclark »

nightski wrote: post #139
dvdhnt wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surely, you aren't comparing mass murder, likely an international crime, to spray painting a building or stealing a TV? Property != people. People > property. Period. Nothing else to consider. Additionally, it's fairly common for security forces to instigate criminal behavior during protests in order to justify the extreme measures they use to suppress those protests.

I am from the area and I agree wholeheartedly that people > property. But let's be real, we saw a 182 unit multi story low income housing unit burn down to ash (the blaze was enormous). We also saw a police department building burn to ash. Countless local businesses have been completely destroyed by fire. That's a little more than spray paint and tv looting.

> But let's be real, we saw a 182 unit multi story low income housing unit burn down to ash (the blaze was enormous).

This was a housing development that had some low-income units, but the majority were "market-price."

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