Why are Soviet math textbooks so hardcore in comparison to US textbooks? (2017) • Hacker News Board

Re: Why are Soviet math textbooks so hardcore in comparison to US textbooks? (2017)

#521

Post by thisisnico » Wed, Apr 22, 2020, 2:06 PM UTC

seibelj wrote: post #52

thisisnico wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Using only free weights and a pull-up bar will work. But it doesn't mean it's the most effective way to body-build. You can write a program from scratch in C to perform an task, or you could use all of the tools of your disposal to far more e f f e c t i v e l y complete the task, potentially without code. You don't need anything except a chalk board but there may be more effective ways to obtain the result you are l…

I have been working with a trainer for many years, and almost everything we do is with free weights and a bench. Free weights are much more difficult because you need to keep them stable. Machines trick you into thinking you are using more weight, but you are leveraging the machine. The only machines I like are leg press and cable machines that still make you keep stability. A true bench press with a bar is much bett…

It's generally better to work out with free-weights because of the stabilization aspect, yes. Saying that Free weights are better flat-out is wrong in my opinion. Every piece of equipment in the gym is a tool if used effectively and at the right time. Your "core" program will be done with free-weights yes, the other equipment is great for auxiliary uses that compliment your program. Machines are great for end of workout sets because you're likely already fairly fatigued and form may be compromised. You can get that little extra by using machines to ensure perfect form while also safely adding that extra stimulation for the muscle groups being trained.

Re: Why are Soviet math textbooks so hardcore in comparison to US textbooks? (2017)

#522

Post by ajuc » Wed, Apr 22, 2020, 2:08 PM UTC

paganel wrote: post #307

missosoup wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think on average the difference between a high school student from Russia and US is negligible I went to high school in Russia and then moved to Australia. The difference was immense. It felt like i just dropped 2 year levels. Even the accelerated programs were hopelessly behind the regular curriculum for my age group in Russia. AU/US high school students can't possibly compete against RU or CN high school studen…

> One of the major factors is this weird anti-intellectualism culture that just doesn't exist in Russia. It was the same thing in Romania, at least in the '90s, when I went to school/high-school. It was always strange to me seeing all those American movies of the "nerds"/geeks getting persecuted by the "cool" kids, it certainly didn't happen to kids in my school and I'm pretty sure it generally didn't happen to kids…

I was the nerd in my class and I was bullied at primary school in Poland in 90s, but that's because I had lots of pretty obvious sicknesses (asthma, skin allergies, half the time I was going to school with my arms bandaged, I wasn't participating in sports, etc.).

Being good at everything was actually cooler than being bad, especially if you were pretending you're naturally smart and didn't have to work to achieve that. I never understood how come kids in American TV are bullied for being smarter than the others, usually being smart is an advantage. On the other hand if you worked hard for grades or (even worse) were a favorite of some teacher and sucked up to her - you were a "kujon" and that was very uncool.

So everybody pretended they are brilliant and never study for even 10 minutes just know everything :)

Re: Why are Soviet math textbooks so hardcore in comparison to US textbooks? (2017)

#523

Post by selimthegrim » Wed, Apr 22, 2020, 2:08 PM UTC

TomMarius wrote: post #475

de_watcher wrote: post #465

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "social capital" was based on the proximity to the ruling minority. The power was greatly centralized so there weren't many of those type of families. Majority had all same: same stuff like photocopied all over the place. About the beatings: it's more about the Russian culture, it's even kinda normal for the husband-wife relationships in some regions. To the West there was less of it.

> The "social capital" was based on the proximity to the ruling minority. The power was greatly centralized so there weren't many of those type of families. Majority had all same: same stuff like photocopied all over the place. Sounds like something from a school history textbook. It was way more complicated than that; the "ruling minority" or proximity to it was nearly irrelevant to most people (and also a direct th…

ex-YU? GDR?

Re: Why are Soviet math textbooks so hardcore in comparison to US textbooks? (2017)

#524

Post by Symbiote » Wed, Apr 22, 2020, 2:10 PM UTC

jojobas wrote: post #488

Symbiote wrote: post #399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a state standard in England and Wales (and another standard in Scotland). It's called the National Curriculum, although I'm not sure if it has a different name for A-levels. There are multiple implementations of that standard, in the form of exams that meet the standards. The government checks the exams satisfy their standards. For example, an exam on history might by on the 20th century Britain, and a diffe…

Again, the Russian standard doesn't give you choices. Everyone has to know logarithms, derivatives and certain chapters of history. The advanced maths selective school will hammer you with more complicated geometry problems, and some contents of the first few uni courses.

Everyone in England also has to know logarithms and derivatives. There's much less flexibility for maths.

For history, the government requires that they:

• develop and extend their knowledge and understanding of specified key events, periods and societies in local, British, and wider world history; and of the wide diversity of human experience

• engage in historical enquiry to develop as independent learners and as critical and reflective thinkers

• develop the ability to ask relevant questions about the past, to investigate issues critically and to make valid historical claims by using a range of sources in their historical context

• develop an awareness of why people, events and developments have been accorded historical significance and how and why different interpretations have been constructed about them

• organise and communicate their historical knowledge and understanding in different ways and reach substantiated conclusions

The topics should be:

• from three eras: Medieval (500-1500), Early Modern (1450-1750) and Modern (1700-present day)

• on three time scales: short (depth study), medium (period study) and long (thematic study)

• on three geographical contexts: a locality (the historic environment); British; and European and / or wider world settings

and "British history must form a minimum of 40% of the assessed content over the full course."

Beyond that, it's up to the people making the exams.

I think this is great -- everyone should learn the techniques ("to investigate issues critically" etc) but the school, teacher and student have some flexibility in their learning. At university or in life, it hardly matters whether I focussed on Roman Britain or European WWII history to achieve this.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/...

Re: Why are Soviet math textbooks so hardcore in comparison to US textbooks? (2017)

#525

Post by baybal2 » Wed, Apr 22, 2020, 2:10 PM UTC

ahoyleo wrote: post #471

baybal2 wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FYI: Big Bang Theory is banned in China

Nope. First search result on Baidu leads to this: http://tv.sohu.com/s2018/dsjshdbzdsyji/ tv.sohu is one of the largest streaming sites in China.

That's a surprise. Apparently, it got unbanned

Re: Why are Soviet math textbooks so hardcore in comparison to US textbooks? (2017)

#526

Post by cafard » Wed, Apr 22, 2020, 2:13 PM UTC

A neighbor in Washington, DC, sent her son for tutoring at the so-named Russian School of Mathematics here.

Re: Why are Soviet math textbooks so hardcore in comparison to US textbooks? (2017)

#527

Post by ajuc » Wed, Apr 22, 2020, 2:14 PM UTC

aga98mtl wrote: post #515

cyphar wrote: post #423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My family is from Serbia (my parents were both mathematics teachers in Serbia) and I was raised here in Australia. It's definitely true that the curriculum is many years behind even relatively poor and corrupt countries (like Serbia). As a toy example, my parents taught me how to solve simultaneous equations in year 4 (when they'd have taught it in Serbia) while everyone else had to wait until year 9 to learn it in s…

> we're doing a massive disservice to our young people which they will have to overcome for the rest of their lives. Is this actually the case? Much of the most useful science & software comes from people educated in the Americas and Western Europe. I think that non-western schooling methodologies under-value problem solving and overvalue "raw" knowledge.

Most of the useful science comes from people imigrating to rich countries from poor countries :)

They have the basics, motivation, and opportunities.

Those that stay in poor countries don't have opportunities nor motivation. Those that come from rich countries don't have the basics nor motivation.

It's a generalization, of course.

Re: Why are Soviet math textbooks so hardcore in comparison to US textbooks? (2017)

#528

Post by yters » Wed, Apr 22, 2020, 2:15 PM UTC

TimTheTinker wrote: post #177

yters wrote: post #131

I think it comes down to communism. According to Marx's book "The Machine" the end game of communism is essentially an omnibenevolent AI. Marx thought eventually all forms of labor would be mechanised into a colossal machine that would run the world. Thus, the whole point of education is to train the geniuses in math, science, and technology in order to bring about this machine god. That's, in my opinion, why there i…

That’s fascinating... and somewhat terrifying. Because it seems clear to me that it won’t require communism or totalitarianism to achieve that kind of endgame (or at least, to get really close to it). Perhaps the communist/totalitarian/power-hungry nations of the world are sitting back and waiting for us in western nations to build such a system (think AWS, but 30 years from now). All they have to do is get complete…

Here's the cite: http://thenewobjectivity.com/pdf/marx.pdf

"once adopted into the production process of capital, the means of labour passes through different metamorphoses, whose culmination is the machine, or rather, an automatic system of machinery (system of machinery: the automatic one is merely its most complete, most adequate form, and alone transforms machinery into a system), set in motion by an automaton, a moving power that moves itself; this automaton consisting of numerous mechanical and intellectual organs, so that the workers themselves are cast merely as its conscious linkages"

Re: Why are Soviet math textbooks so hardcore in comparison to US textbooks? (2017)

#529

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Apr 22, 2020, 2:23 PM UTC

imtringued wrote: post #451

growlist wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a person is horrified by the idea that some children are superior learners due to genetics and yet this person sees their attempts to develop inferior learners fail, their only option to achieve equality is then to socially engineer the superior learners downwards to match their political viewpoint. And it's also great business in a deindustrialised nation to milk gullible students for tens of thousands of pounds…

I'm not sure why the reason for superior performance matters. Genetics are just one tiny factor. Good parenting and nutrition are often more important.

[deleted]

Re: Why are Soviet math textbooks so hardcore in comparison to US textbooks? (2017)

#530

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Apr 22, 2020, 2:25 PM UTC

oiunqorucwonieu wrote: post #472

missosoup wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think on average the difference between a high school student from Russia and US is negligible I went to high school in Russia and then moved to Australia. The difference was immense. It felt like i just dropped 2 year levels. Even the accelerated programs were hopelessly behind the regular curriculum for my age group in Russia. AU/US high school students can't possibly compete against RU or CN high school studen…

> I went to high school in Russia and then moved to Australia. The difference was immense. It felt like i just dropped 2 year levels. I know nothing about your history, but usually moving to a new country means you are now an immigrant and by definition have less privilege than before, even if you can't immediately notice it. Another hypothesis is that you left an elitist good school in russia and joined a not-so eli…

[deleted]