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Joyent: 54+ hours of downtime

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: Joyent: 54+ hours of downtime

#61

Post by shareme »

The lesson jasonhoffman could learn:

If you have a small set of users who bought lifetime accounts to bet on a company you founded than even with new company I would bend over backwards to make sure their needs are met as a thank you.

Otherwise some gets the bright idea to put up a joynet sucks web page with proper Google approved SEO and makes this little PR bump a big EFFING MOUNTAIN!'

jasonhoffman, I imagine you have less than 12 hours before that happens..as TechCrunch may do it for 'free'..:)

Re: Joyent: 54+ hours of downtime

#62

Post by jedsmith »

iskander wrote: post #45
jasonhoffman wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also incorrect. "About 4 years ago" we always did >99.99% uptimes even on the old textdrive stuff. I'd be happy to show all the old stats and graphs, we still have them.

Jason, you're experiencing a PR hiccup; it's not a big deal but it's also not clear that responding to every message in this thread is going to help you. Instead, why not (1) make things right for the OP and everyone else on Howe and (2) put a response on the blog? You Joyent folks will never get a subset of your customers to migrate off textdrive hardware (so it's no use to keep yelling "just migrate!"). However, if…

I get having a passion for your product -- I really do. Some of the responses here from Jason are on the border line, though, and I think they are making the situation worse overall. I wish, for his sake, that he'd have quit while ahead.

Without a doubt, Jason has the best intentions here, but I'm getting a really bad vibe from reading the entire thread -- particularly the by the way, you contributed to a ticket and I can look it up so I'm going to remind you so that you'll look stupid for bitching about us bit.

The hostile you-are-wrong attitude, while maybe technically correct, is a disaster for outside perception.

Re: Joyent: 54+ hours of downtime

#63

Post by enduser »

swombat wrote: post #60
jasonhoffman wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For example, read the comments below from quintinsykes and chuckmcknight.

Seems like the lesson for you here is: never give free hosting, people feel terribly entitled once they have it and their negative feedback may cause trouble in your actual products.

The hosting is not free. It was paid for in advance.

Re: Joyent: 54+ hours of downtime

#64

Post by officemonkey »

jasonhoffman wrote: post #36
enduser wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Offering a transition from FreeBSD to Solaris that requires the effort of the customer is not free. Asking a customer who knows FreeBSD to take on administration of a Solaris virtual server for your convenience is not reasonable. You are offering an unacceptable level of service to customers who have supported and recommended you from your early days. You were paid in advance for a lifetime of service. I took you on…

To even call this "Joyent" is misleading. The packing system is the same, it's BSD userland. The paths are the same. Everything is the same. The kernel shouldn't matter. And if you had told support that you wanted us to just migrate you because nothing was out of the ordinary, what would they have done? They would have migrated you .... And this has been quite a good deal for you. The logic of moving from something t…

>And this has been quite a good deal for you. The logic of moving from something that costs you nothing to something that does costs you something is interesting.

Downtime costs him. So much so that he's willing to pay for uptime.

Also, it didn't cost him "nothing". He paid for service. It wasn't free.

Your reply sounds like you don't value him as a customer anymore because he's not giving you money anymore. Nobody forced textdrive into offering the "lifetime" package. You should treat him like a valued old customer, rather than calling his logic "interesting".

Re: Joyent: 54+ hours of downtime

#65

Post by officemonkey »

swombat wrote: post #58
itsnotvalid wrote: post #10

http://www.joyentcloud.com/about/policies/cloud-service-leve... For clause 2: 2. Service Level Goal: Joyent’s goal is to achieve 100% Availability for all customers. Remedy: Subject to Sections 3 and 4 below, if the Availability of customer’s Grid Container is less than 100%, Joyent will credit the customer 5% of the monthly fee for each 30 minutes of downtime (up to 100% of customer’s monthly fee for the affected se…

Sounds like the OP is getting the service for free anyway...

It wasn't "free". We bought a "lifetime" package. I don't recall the details, but I ponied up a couple hundred dollars at a time when we didn't know textdrive was going to make it. I don't expect a lot of support, but I do expect uptime and courtesy.

Re: Joyent: 54+ hours of downtime

#66

Post by elq »

swombat wrote: post #60
jasonhoffman wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For example, read the comments below from quintinsykes and chuckmcknight.

Seems like the lesson for you here is: never give free hosting, people feel terribly entitled once they have it and their negative feedback may cause trouble in your actual products.

I paid $400 for lifetime service via the vc2 drive sometime in mid 2005. I got about 2.5 years of usable service before I completely abandoned textdrive. An effective rate of $160/yr for really marginal shared hosting.

I currently pay ~$215/year for a linode account.

I will continue to pay for linode.

Re: Joyent: 54+ hours of downtime

#67

Post by jedsmith »

officemonkey wrote: post #64
jasonhoffman wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To even call this "Joyent" is misleading. The packing system is the same, it's BSD userland. The paths are the same. Everything is the same. The kernel shouldn't matter. And if you had told support that you wanted us to just migrate you because nothing was out of the ordinary, what would they have done? They would have migrated you .... And this has been quite a good deal for you. The logic of moving from something t…

>And this has been quite a good deal for you. The logic of moving from something that costs you nothing to something that does costs you something is interesting. Downtime costs him. So much so that he's willing to pay for uptime. Also, it didn't cost him "nothing". He paid for service. It wasn't free. Your reply sounds like you don't value him as a customer anymore because he's not giving you money anymore. Nobody f…

> Your reply sounds like you don't value him as a customer anymore because he's not giving you money anymore.

I think you mean: replies.

Re: Joyent: 54+ hours of downtime

#68

Post by amock »

jasonhoffman wrote: post #26
frankwiles wrote: post #16

I have one single client who refuses to move off Joyent. My experience with them has been less than stellar. Frequent problems with no explanations, ask a support question like "How does one do X on your system?" and often get "oh you want to do Y I see, here is a link to the support forum for that." and the link isn't at all related to X or even the Y. They aren't horrible, but I would never use or recommend them to…

If you're on an old textdrive server, then you need to move, like we've been saying.

Have you considered offering to buy back the lifetime offers from people who won't migrate? It seems like that might be cheaper in the long run than having to support the old BSD servers forever.

Re: Joyent: 54+ hours of downtime

#69

Post by tedjdziuba »

shareme wrote: post #61

The lesson jasonhoffman could learn: If you have a small set of users who bought lifetime accounts to bet on a company you founded than even with new company I would bend over backwards to make sure their needs are met as a thank you. Otherwise some gets the bright idea to put up a joynet sucks web page with proper Google approved SEO and makes this little PR bump a big EFFING MOUNTAIN!' jasonhoffman, I imagine you h…

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Re: Joyent: 54+ hours of downtime

#70

Post by jarin »

There seems to be some confusion in this thread about the difference between "free" and "paid for in advance".

Cutco will re-sharpen your knives for free, no matter how old they are, even if you bought them on eBay, because they made a 'lifetime resharpening' promise with the original purchase. And they're basically a multi-level marketing scam.

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