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RISC-V Foundation moving to Switzerland over trade curb fears

reuters.com

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Re: RISC-V Foundation moving to Switzerland over trade curb fears

#111
post #50
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Corporations have only themselves to blame for the failure of the TPP. Instead of limiting the agreement to trade, it was filled to the brim with anti-consumer, anti-worker, and anti-environment clauses. Negotiated entirely by industry and kept secret from even senators, laundering legislation they could never get through any parliament. If there was any justice in the world, the TPP would not only have failed, but e…

The bigger criticism I heard about the TPP was extending America's Intellectual Property laws even further across the globe. And the secrecy was annoying as well. What anti-consumer, anti-worker and anti-environment clauses are you referring to? Of course, from the standpoint of mainstream economic theory, trade agreements are moot for their stated purpose: everyone is better off just opening up to unilateral free tr…

> What anti-consumer, anti-worker and anti-environment clauses are you referring to?

The mentioned IP clauses would be anti-consumer, criminal penalties for trade secrets, and the horrifyingly 'standard' investor-state arbitration, which can throw a wrench into any pro-consumer/worker/environment law, as they usually impact corporate profit, meaning lawyers can argue that this is an indirect form of expropriation. It has a chilling effect on legislation. E.g. Canada backed off cigarette plain packaging and pesticide registration due to the arbitration clauses in NAFTA: https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20141121/07460329216/corpo...

A law professor made the same argument specifically in reference to the TPP - that the government would basically have to pay a tax to corporations on any legislation that cuts into their profits: https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/gord-miller/trans-pacific-part...

"Dean Baker argued that Article 18.78, under which countries should ensure that they protect trade secrets and impose criminal procedures for violators, could be used to enforce non-compete agreements.": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Pacific_Partnership

And much of the TPP's more noble language, such as environmental and worker protections, is non-binding, and even explicitly subordinate to other parts of the agreement: "In the event of any inconsistency between this Chapter and another Chapter of this Agreement, the other Chapter shall prevail to the extent of the inconsistency.": https://theconversation.com/the-trans-pacific-partnership-po...

Basically, if it were remotely good, it would not have been negotiated in such secrecy. Think about who it was kept secret from - not the counterparties in the negotiations, so it cannot be argued the secrecy was to preserve some 'advantage'.

Re: RISC-V Foundation moving to Switzerland over trade curb fears

#112

I appreciate and welcome this move by RISC-V foundation. With semiconductor industry being used as a major soft power, countries which don't have such power betting on RISC-V[1], it's wise to move to a neutral country. My only gripe being, there aren't many neutral countries which can stand up to powerful militarized nations. Edit: The reason, I mentioned lack of military power of neutral countries is because of the…

No-one is going to invade Switzerland. A country like the US can invade any country they want. International law is irrelevant. But they can pressure a country like Switzerland without needing to resort to military action, which would be crazy anyway in the case of Switzerland.

[deleted]

Re: RISC-V Foundation moving to Switzerland over trade curb fears

#113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More being sick of the US' controlling attitude.

Probably some of that but there is a scary attempt to regulate the world by a ruthless regime. Its a question that must be asked, sadly

Indeed, and relocating away from that regime is a good first step in cutting ties.

Re: RISC-V Foundation moving to Switzerland over trade curb fears

#114

I appreciate and welcome this move by RISC-V foundation. With semiconductor industry being used as a major soft power, countries which don't have such power betting on RISC-V[1], it's wise to move to a neutral country. My only gripe being, there aren't many neutral countries which can stand up to powerful militarized nations. Edit: The reason, I mentioned lack of military power of neutral countries is because of the…

No-one is going to invade Switzerland. A country like the US can invade any country they want. International law is irrelevant. But they can pressure a country like Switzerland without needing to resort to military action, which would be crazy anyway in the case of Switzerland.

US have already pressured Swiss to remove bank secrecy, which is kinda a big deal.

Re: RISC-V Foundation moving to Switzerland over trade curb fears

#116
post #104
post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Hague invasion act" =:-O The US truly are the bully in the room.

The US has a strong commitment to pardoning its war criminals and human rights violators. https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-usa-trump-warcrimes-pardon... This, incidentally, is why it's hard to take seriously the idea that US positioning against China is aimed at genuinely improving human rights and not just using them as rhetorical cover.

...while at the same time US law seem to magically apply everywhere in the world. Extradition to the US is very common. Not to mention https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraordinary_rendition

Re: RISC-V Foundation moving to Switzerland over trade curb fears

#117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What's truly brainless is thinking we can just bury our heads in the sand and ignore an ever expanding Totalitarian dictatorship bent on becoming the world's most powerful country. I'd be more in line with this reasoning if the intent of the trade war was to incentivize better moral outcomes. This war won't end in China becoming less of a totalitarian power, nor will it stop China growing as an economic power. The…

>...without the expense of having to provide human rights and freedoms If you assume that raising a small population of creative, technical problem-solvers requires this expense, then China has successfully outsourced that role to 'us' (meaning Western democracies, esp. the US), just as we've outsourced our manufacturing workforce to them. I think a trade-war is justified in retaliation for rampant systematic IP thef…

I'm not sure how you've come to this belief that there isn't a population of creative, technical problem-solvers in China. I'm very much certain of the opposite. China is a large nation with a super-size talent pool drawn from a monster labour force, with a strong cultural heritage and long history of state provided education opportunities. The US isn't some sort of exception here. If anything, it wastes much of it's population by asking poor people to jump through a series of hoops before they can even contemplate higher education.

Edit:

I think I should add, this kind of naivete is what caught the western world by surprise in the WWII in the Pacific. I'm sourcing my 'facts' from Dan Carlin here, but essentially the British command in Singapore, as well as the US, vastly underestimated the ingenuity of the Japanese, claiming them to be great at imitation, but not at innovation, and generally a disorganised and an underwhelming military opponent. This thinking led to Pearl Harbour, the dramatic taking of Singapore and the sinking of some very expensive battleships. Their air forces quickly overwhelmed and outclassed by the technically superior Japanese planes, handled with precision by well-trained pilots, and directed with strategy bold and unseen by even well-tested veterans who had seen action in Europe. Large scale military defeats down to foolish racial stereo-typing from the top down. I'd say the US should watch it's six.

Re: RISC-V Foundation moving to Switzerland over trade curb fears

#118
post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Hague invasion act" =:-O The US truly are the bully in the room.

Interestingly, the US would also have an obligation to defend The Hague against any invasion if the Netherlands were to invoke Article Five of the NATO treaty.

This can be invoked only if non-NATO member attacks...

Re: RISC-V Foundation moving to Switzerland over trade curb fears

#119
post #96

I appreciate and welcome this move by RISC-V foundation. With semiconductor industry being used as a major soft power, countries which don't have such power betting on RISC-V[1], it's wise to move to a neutral country. My only gripe being, there aren't many neutral countries which can stand up to powerful militarized nations. Edit: The reason, I mentioned lack of military power of neutral countries is because of the…

"Hague invasion act" =:-O The US truly are the bully in the room.

How is that bullying? The US doesn’t submit to the jurisdiction of the ICC, which is voluntary. (India isn’t a member either.) Clinton never submitted it to the Senate for ratification. Prosecution of an American by the ICC would therefore be an act of aggression and military response would be warranted.

The US, in general, is defensive of its sovereignty. We have our own institutions and we are very protective of them. For example, we have a right to a jury trial by one’s peers n a criminal case. The ICC has no juries, and panelists are generally foreigners to the defendant. Criminal convictions in US federal courts (and nearly all states) require a unanimous verdict. The ICC requires a simple majority. The ICC allows trials in abstentia, regularly relies on hearsay evidence, etc. Our highest court is the United States Supreme Court. But the Supreme Court cannot hear appeals from the ICC and cannot issue judgments binding on the ICC. Our practices in these areas, such as jury trials, are the part of an unbroken line of law and tradition dating back to the Magna Carta in 1215. Those practices can be refined and improved, but that’s completely orthogonal to submitting to the jurisdiction of supra-national organizations like the ICC. Our institutions can always be improved. But that doesn’t mean we have to submit to someone else’s institutions.

In my view, the real question is why others are so willing to give up their sovereignty and right to self determination? Why submit to the will of some foreign court that’s totally outside the framework of your own country’s laws, constitution, and institutions?

Re: RISC-V Foundation moving to Switzerland over trade curb fears

#120
post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Hague invasion act" =:-O The US truly are the bully in the room.

Just to clarify, it is officially called 'American Service-Members' Protection Act' which was supposedly passed as there was a chance George W. Bush could be arrested & tried at ICC for war crimes; media & human rights organizations call it 'Hague invasion act' for what it is.

he was already tried in absentia. It was easy, there are many TV interviews where W does a full confession by saying torture produces good information.
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