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Huawei reviewing FedEx relationship, says packages 'diverted'

reuters.com

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Re: Huawei reviewing FedEx relationship, says packages 'diverted'

#131

Post by JumpCrisscross »

DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #127
_ptgt wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The allegations against Huawei aren't that it "imported goods into Iran." The allegations are that it imported American goods into Iran, which is clearly a violation of US export laws. If such laws didn't apply to third-party distributors of American goods, then the only effect of US sanctions would be have foreign distributors exporting American goods rather than American ones. Huawei appears to have known this as w…

The allegation is not quite that Huawei imported American goods into Iran. The accusation is that Huawei misled a non-American bank, HSBC, about its relationship with Skycom, a company that is accused of importing some American office computers into Iran. The US alleges that Huawei essentially controls Skycom, and that it hid this from HSBC, a British bank. Since HSBC does business in the US, it would not be allowed…

> what gives the US any jurisdiction to demand the arrest of a foreign executive on foreign territory, for acts committed on foreign territory

She violated American laws with American products using U.S. dollars for years. She then travelled to an American ally.

This is a stupid counter argument.

Re: Huawei reviewing FedEx relationship, says packages 'diverted'

#132

Post by truth_be_told »

strooper wrote: post #43

Not related to this package delivery drama, but the way we are observing the live demolition of the world largest networking equipment maker and second largest smartphone maker (by number) in the name of trade war will never bring back the confidence in those who are flexing muscle. The illusion of the rule of law, free world, globalization and the reality of control is simply frightening, and worrisome.

Spot on! Nothing has changed from the colonial era except having been dressed up in "genteel" clothes of "rule of law as long as it is to OUR benefit". Every country is learning from this and nobody is going to trust the US anymore. It is all lies, sham and hypocrisy. The western countries have lost the lead in Wireless Mobile technology and instead of admitting it and redoubling their efforts to win back the lead, they are engaged in tearing down the company and the country who beat them.

Re: Huawei reviewing FedEx relationship, says packages 'diverted'

#133

Post by DiogenesKynikos »

rgbrenner wrote: post #120
close04 wrote: post #16

> FedEx spokeswoman Maury Donahue told Reuters the packages were “misrouted in error” and that FedEx was not requested to divert them by any other party. Scout's honor. Sounds a lot like Huawei saying it was just a coding error. Would they get away of a spying accusation with this? If it can happen in the US (FedEx, Cisco) it can surely happen in China. It's strange seeing people defending this as "probably an error"…

The difference is that Huawei has a board of CCP members that sits within Huawei and has say over their actions. While FedEx is an independent company that operates within the US, and has access to US courts to defend themselves. It's 1st party vs 3rd party, when it comes to government influence. Huawei is assumed to be working at behalf of the CCP because the CCP has management control over the company. It's like Fa…

Huawei executives make management decisions at Huawei, not the CCP. I presume that what you're referencing is the existence of a CCP group at Huawei. As I understand it, all Chinese companies above a certain number of employees have a party section. That doesn't mean that the CCP controls those companies, any more than having a union means the AFL-CIO controls an American company. Huawei is subject to the same sort of potential government pressure, however, that American companies might face. If the US government sends a national security letter, American companies have to quietly comply.

Re: Huawei reviewing FedEx relationship, says packages 'diverted'

#134

Post by DiogenesKynikos »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #131
DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The allegation is not quite that Huawei imported American goods into Iran. The accusation is that Huawei misled a non-American bank, HSBC, about its relationship with Skycom, a company that is accused of importing some American office computers into Iran. The US alleges that Huawei essentially controls Skycom, and that it hid this from HSBC, a British bank. Since HSBC does business in the US, it would not be allowed…

> what gives the US any jurisdiction to demand the arrest of a foreign executive on foreign territory, for acts committed on foreign territory She violated American laws with American products using U.S. dollars for years. She then travelled to an American ally. This is a stupid counter argument.

Where does the US have jurisdiction? This is a legitimate question. What legal right does the US government have to enforce US laws on a foreigner who isn't in the US, for actions taken outside the US and which were not illegal in the country the person resides in? I'd legitimately like to know what sort of legal argument is used to justify this, because it sounds like a massive overreach by the United States. Regardless, arresting the CFO of a major corporation - the daughter of the CEO - in such a manner is an extremely aggressive act.

Re: Huawei reviewing FedEx relationship, says packages 'diverted'

#135

Post by lyrachord »

majia wrote: post #111

Fedex diverted huawei’s packet through the US by mistake. China telecom diverted internet packets through China because it must be hacking. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18385920

Only fools believe in some things from the oracle company.

Re: Huawei reviewing FedEx relationship, says packages 'diverted'

#136

Post by threezero »

DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #134
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what gives the US any jurisdiction to demand the arrest of a foreign executive on foreign territory, for acts committed on foreign territory She violated American laws with American products using U.S. dollars for years. She then travelled to an American ally. This is a stupid counter argument.

Where does the US have jurisdiction? This is a legitimate question. What legal right does the US government have to enforce US laws on a foreigner who isn't in the US, for actions taken outside the US and which were not illegal in the country the person resides in? I'd legitimately like to know what sort of legal argument is used to justify this, because it sounds like a massive overreach by the United States. Regard…

The US has a reciprocal agreement with Canada. These agreements are the basis for jurisdiction.

Re: Huawei reviewing FedEx relationship, says packages 'diverted'

#137

Post by threezero »

coliveira wrote: post #60
strooper wrote: post #43

Not related to this package delivery drama, but the way we are observing the live demolition of the world largest networking equipment maker and second largest smartphone maker (by number) in the name of trade war will never bring back the confidence in those who are flexing muscle. The illusion of the rule of law, free world, globalization and the reality of control is simply frightening, and worrisome.

What they're doing to Huawei will have nefarious consequences to the US. Who can ever trust a country that can use this kind of tactics to destroy a comercial competitor?

You mean like China forcing foreign companies to turn over technology to Chinese companies to eventually be used to compete against them? Who could ever trust a country that does that, or that imprisons millions of people based on their religion?

Re: Huawei reviewing FedEx relationship, says packages 'diverted'

#138

Post by codedokode »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #44
strooper wrote: post #43

Not related to this package delivery drama, but the way we are observing the live demolition of the world largest networking equipment maker and second largest smartphone maker (by number) in the name of trade war will never bring back the confidence in those who are flexing muscle. The illusion of the rule of law, free world, globalization and the reality of control is simply frightening, and worrisome.

> The illusion of the rule of law Rule of law has always been national. International politics are anarchic. Huawei quite clearly broke the laws of the United States ( e.g. with respect to Iran), repeatedly and wilfully.

> Huawei quite clearly broke the laws

Was it proven in court or we should just believe everything US administration says?

Re: Huawei reviewing FedEx relationship, says packages 'diverted'

#139

Post by kpremote »

friedman23 wrote: post #98
coliveira wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What they're doing to Huawei will have nefarious consequences to the US. Who can ever trust a country that can use this kind of tactics to destroy a comercial competitor?

> What they're doing to Huawei will have nefarious consequences to the US And what consequences do you imagine there will be?

The consequences might be like this (in addition to many other possible forms):

Previously, my little factory spent 100% of the budget for component x and component y on buying from American suppliers (quality and price are both very good).

But going forward, we plan to spend 70% to buy from Americans, 20% from other countries, and 10% to fund demestic research, and we will reduce the 70% part as soon as we can manage.

You can imagine if multiplying our small adjustment by the actions of hundreds of thousands of similar businesses around the world who are watching closely what's going on recently, then the interests of American businesses will probably be severely affected.

Re: Huawei reviewing FedEx relationship, says packages 'diverted'

#140

Post by Bendingo »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #44
strooper wrote: post #43

Not related to this package delivery drama, but the way we are observing the live demolition of the world largest networking equipment maker and second largest smartphone maker (by number) in the name of trade war will never bring back the confidence in those who are flexing muscle. The illusion of the rule of law, free world, globalization and the reality of control is simply frightening, and worrisome.

> The illusion of the rule of law Rule of law has always been national. International politics are anarchic. Huawei quite clearly broke the laws of the United States ( e.g. with respect to Iran), repeatedly and wilfully.

Since when does the US set laws for Huawei? The attitude that the whole world must obey US laws is being increasingly rejected. And not before time.
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