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Article 13 is almost finished and will change the internet as we know it

juliareda.eu

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Re: Article 13 is almost finished and will change the internet as we know it

#251

Post by paulie_a »

yostrovs wrote: post #204
drewbuschhorn wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like we had this exact same argument over GDPR, but no horror stories have descended about Mom and Pop operations run out of business but the evil Brusselcrats.

It's not clear what's going on with GDPR, good test cases are only now starting to be tested. But the fact that many American newspapers, for example, are blocked in Europe is certainly something to worry about.

American newspapers don't need to care about GDPR. Most websites don't need to care about GDPR. Europe does not get to dictate how non European based websites operate. The GDPR can be outright ignored for a significant part of the internet. I have no idea why an American newspaper would give a shit about GDPR. They could literally put a huge banner up saying "fuck GDPR" and face zero legal consequences.

Re: Article 13 is almost finished and will change the internet as we know it

#252

Post by tomp »

fuscy wrote: post #239
drewbuschhorn wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like we had this exact same argument over GDPR, but no horror stories have descended about Mom and Pop operations run out of business but the evil Brusselcrats.

This is not related to business but there's a horror story with Romania (it's in the EU) asking a news organization to provide informants information related to some corruption leaks. The information is requested by the national GDPR enforcer so it bypasses the prevention written in the GDPR about news leaks. Now there's a trial going around with this which blocked any further spread of that information until it's so…

Isn't that just straight abuse of the law? AFAIK GDPR only protects your personal information, it can't be used to request someone else's personal information (if anything, you could argue that GDPR prevents you from giving out another person's info).

Re: Article 13 is almost finished and will change the internet as we know it

#253

Post by coldtea »

isostatic wrote: post #210
coldtea wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Perfectly functioning and always has been"? That is beyond delusion. The EU is co-ruled by an opaque system of non elected bodies, under the table deals, and backroom diplomacy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_deficit_in_the_Euro... https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/mar/09/brexit... https://www.economist.com/special-report/2017/03/23/how-to-a... https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1007/S12…

> The EU is co-ruled by an opaque system of non elected bodies The EU council (comprising of democratically elected heads of government from the 28 member countries) The EU parliament (comprising of directly elected MEPs from the 28 member countries) The EU commission president, nominated by the council, approved by the parliament, and standing on a ticket to be EU Commission president during the parliamentary electi…

That's the version told to high schoolers in "How the EU works" lessons.

In actual EU, decisions are made by informal bodies like the Eurogroup, meeting under close quarters and with no documentation, with economic and diplomatic pressure from top dog countries, with satellite states vote how their sugar daddy states ask them, and a whole lot more besides.

Re: Article 13 is almost finished and will change the internet as we know it

#254

Post by ThomPete »

toyg wrote: post #201
ThomPete wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is exactly the ongoing problem with the EU they don't distinguish between large corporations and small businesses which really illustrate how clueless the EU is when it comes to the market and the businesses that are governed.

The post explicitly mentions a clause that will make that distinction. The author argues it might be removed from the final text as part of the ongoing horse-trading, but at least it’s clear MEPs do understand the difference nowadays.

If they did they wouldn't have implemented GDRP as it was. The very fact that it might be removed in a horse-trade illustrates my point.

Re: Article 13 is almost finished and will change the internet as we know it

#255

Post by codezero »

GuB-42 wrote: post #160

It looks surprisingly reasonable. "internet platforms that organise and promote large amounts of copyright-protected works uploaded by their users in order to make a profit" That's actually a lot of limitation. From my understanding: "organise and promote" means it is not simple hosting, and "in order to make a profit" excludes organizations like Wikimedia Commons and "large amounts" most likely excludes smaller webs…

I thought most clips on Pornhub were uploaded by the content owners, basically as advertisement for their sites. They are not full length clips usually, or am I way off?

Re: Article 13 is almost finished and will change the internet as we know it

#256

Post by ThomPete »

yostrovs wrote: post #211
toyg wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The post explicitly mentions a clause that will make that distinction. The author argues it might be removed from the final text as part of the ongoing horse-trading, but at least it’s clear MEPs do understand the difference nowadays.

I don't understand the difference and where one would draw the line between small and large businesses. What about medium businesses?

Medium is part of small (SMBs')

Re: Article 13 is almost finished and will change the internet as we know it

#257

Post by tomp »

losthobbies wrote: post #151

I wrote to my MEP and this is the response I got: Following a number of important amendments being made to the Copyright Directive since July, the proposal was put to a plenary vote in September, which over 60% of MEPs supported. During further negotiations between Parliament, the Council (EU Member States) and the European Commission, any remaining shortcomings can be addressed. I am in favour of a balanced Copyrigh…

Thanks, that's actually a reasonable and balance view. Let's just hope that's what actually gets implemented in the law as well...

Re: Article 13 is almost finished and will change the internet as we know it

#258

Post by jdietrich »

yostrovs wrote: post #204
drewbuschhorn wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like we had this exact same argument over GDPR, but no horror stories have descended about Mom and Pop operations run out of business but the evil Brusselcrats.

It's not clear what's going on with GDPR, good test cases are only now starting to be tested. But the fact that many American newspapers, for example, are blocked in Europe is certainly something to worry about.

The GDPR is very similar to the old Data Protection Directive, which came into force in 1995. Many member states had done a piss-poor job of implementing and enforcing the DPD, which was largely the motivation for passing the GDPR. Directives have to be transposed into national law by individual member states, while regulations are immediately applicable across the entire Union.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_Protection_Directive

Re: Article 13 is almost finished and will change the internet as we know it

#259

Post by deltron3030 »

jaabe wrote: post #46
danijelb wrote: post #22

In a weird way, this might be EU's strategy to finally deal significant damage to Google and Facebook, as this law will encourage development of alternatives on decentralized peer-to-peer technologies. However, I'm not sure if EU politicians are that smart...

It’s not made by EU politicians, it’s made by a combination of lawyers, engineers and public administration majors. In many ways the EU is a functioning technocracy, and if you ever read through the actual EU documents it shows. They are almost always sound, they are also massively bureaucratic and around 90% longer than necessary, but I’ve never read through something that wasn’t sound. Disclaimer: I haven’t read up…

>but I’ve never read through something that wasn’t sound.

Sound in respect to very general interpretations and "common sense". The problem is that general laws can touch topics that are way beyond common sense, the room of interpretation is then just so big that it's like a weapon to take out anybody if you only dig deep enough and frame it as a problem for the common good.

Re: Article 13 is almost finished and will change the internet as we know it

#260

Post by kd5bjo »

dkersten wrote: post #177
Tor3 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's pre-GDPR (barely), and the original idea was that users should be able to opt out of cookie tracking. But instead most web sites just added that super-annoying (particularly when it covers the whole page) pop-up giving you one option: Accept cookies or else. That was not the intention of the regulation at all. So far I've seen only a single web site that actually gave you the option to not use cookies (yes/no,…

I’ve seen a lot that give you yes/no options. Some of them tell you that you can’t use the site, sorry, when you click no, but I’ve noticed many let me continue on anyway. Of course, I’ve seen even more that give you only an accept option... that, or as sibling commenter said yes/wilderness of options.

I ran across one the other day where the options were yes, and yes worded a little bit differently
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