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Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know

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Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know

#71

Post by goldmouth »

oceanghost wrote: post #34
megaman22 wrote: post #20

Melatonin doses of the standard distribution seem great for crazy fucking dreams, but little else. Drinking two Rolling Rocks or PBR distilleries is more effective;

I did this for a decade. If you drink or smoke pot to sleep you will slowly go mad. They suppress deep sleep.

This is true for alcohol but I'm not sure about cannabis.

In California, a heavy indica is a recommended by doctors for sleep. My understanding is that it only affects R.E.M. sleeep.

Anecdotally, I track my sleep and when I smoked a heavy indica before bed I would consistently get at high 80 to 90% sleep quality. I'm on a couple of month tolerance break and have a hard time breaking 80% sleep quality.

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know

#72

Post by ianai »

amaccuish wrote: post #5

Melatonin has genuinely changed my life in regards to sleep. I'd tried everything and for exams went on Zopiclone, and then found the gold that is Melatonin. Thoroughly recommend anyone with suitable problems sleeping giving it a go. (I was DSPD, though every so often did the whole "Non-24-Hour-Sleep Disorder" thing)

For me, it took a solid two weeks before I saw a regulation of my sleep pattern. Same time of day, 3 hours before I wanted to sleep, turning off all screens and eventually covering my eyes with a sleeping mask. Time released, low (correct) dosing too. Too much melatonin like pushes your brain past sleep.

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know

#73

Post by DoreenMichele »

megaman22 wrote: post #20

Melatonin doses of the standard distribution seem great for crazy fucking dreams, but little else. Drinking two Rolling Rocks or PBR distilleries is more effective;

Melatonin doses of the standard distribution seem great for crazy fucking dreams, but little else.

This suggests to me you are long term dream deprived for some reason, whether due to sleep deprivation or drug use, whether "recreational" or prescription. Anytime you start sleeping better/deeper/more after a long period of sleep deprivation or use of substances that suppress dream function, you have very vivid dreams for a time. This is unavoidable.

Alcohol suppresses dreams. So do many other things.

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know

#74

Post by derefr »

geofft wrote: post #62
lxmorj wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also if it's cheap enough, you can dump half the water after dilution!

Yes, that (or mixing a pitcher of 3mg melatonin and measuring a tenth of it each evening, or something) would also work. Anything with liquid seems way less fiddly than trying to split pills into >2 parts, I'm surprised I don't see more liquid melatonin at stores or more people who know that they want a <1mg dose suggesting liquid melatonin.

> less fiddly

If the melatonin is in pressed-pill form, rather than splitting it, you can just crush it in a mortar, then mix it with more filler (look at which one they’re already using on the bottle and use some of that; they’re usually using the cheapest thing that works.) Then you can simply measure out powder for a dose (rather than measuring out liquid).

If you want to go the extra mile, you can add enough filler to the mixture to fill a grid of gelatin half-capsules, such that you don’t have to worry about measuring doses.

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know

#75

Post by mattbierner »

megaman22 wrote: post #20

Melatonin doses of the standard distribution seem great for crazy fucking dreams, but little else. Drinking two Rolling Rocks or PBR distilleries is more effective;

Dreams were why I started taking melatonin. Taking it before bed, combined with a dream journal, helped me remember significantly more of my dreams—many of which have been absurdly comedic or indescribably beautiful—although how much of this is placebo vs chemical vs ritual is unclear. Now I still take 3mg most nights, but have gone weeks without it and thankfully the dreams didn’t stop (although alcohol certainly does make them go away for the night). Ymmv

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know

#76

Post by craftyguy »

GuardianCaveman wrote: post #66

I never took it because I read a long time ago that it causes your body to decrease melatonin production long term. I guess that’s just a myth because people in this thread seem very positive about using it long term.

People in this thread didn't RTFA (top posts are addressing the title/subject of 'melatonin'), and generally the responses are anecdotal. Don't assume folks here know what they are talking about.

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know

#77

Post by Angostura »

gingerlime wrote: post #67

Anyone knows why Melatonin is available so easily in the US, but you need a prescription for it in Europe? (I haven’t asked my GP though)

My understanding is because it is sold as a food supplement in the U.S while the UK, for example regulates it as a medicine.

So its available for prescription for short-term treatment of sleep disordersm, with provisos such as:

"Melatonin’s metabolism is mainly mediated via CYP1A enzymes. Therefore interactions may occur between melatonin and other drugs affecting or metabolised by CYP1A enzymes e.g. fluvoxamine, cimetidine, ciprofloxacin and other quinolones, carbamazepine, omeprazole, oestrogens (oral contraceptives and HRT), rifampicin, theophylline and increase in blood pressure with nifedipine and reduced prothrombin with warfarin have been reported." etc.

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know

#78

Post by luc4sdreyer »

56chan4 wrote: post #65
codenesium wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I take 300 micrograms I feel groggy the next day. I do half and that's just right. It's crazy people are doing 3-10mg.

Ideally a bedroom needs to be so dark that if you hold you hand up inches away from in front of your nose, you cant see your hand in any way. You may also want to consider good ventilation in the room, if CO2 levels get up to around 700ppm which can happen in a few hours of going to bed, you will also wake up feeling less refreshed and groggy. Its why they have CO2 scrubbers in submarines and why people feel more ref…

> if CO2 levels get up to around 700ppm which can happen in a few hours of going to bed, you will also wake up feeling less refreshed and groggy

source?

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know

#79

Post by Angostura »

ianai wrote: post #72
amaccuish wrote: post #5

Melatonin has genuinely changed my life in regards to sleep. I'd tried everything and for exams went on Zopiclone, and then found the gold that is Melatonin. Thoroughly recommend anyone with suitable problems sleeping giving it a go. (I was DSPD, though every so often did the whole "Non-24-Hour-Sleep Disorder" thing)

For me, it took a solid two weeks before I saw a regulation of my sleep pattern. Same time of day, 3 hours before I wanted to sleep, turning off all screens and eventually covering my eyes with a sleeping mask. Time released, low (correct) dosing too. Too much melatonin like pushes your brain past sleep.

The take-away from that sounds as if you found a sleeping-mask helpful, but there's not much evidence that melatonin had any effect.

Re: Melatonin: Much More Than You Wanted to Know

#80

Post by xor1 »

amaccuish wrote: post #5

Melatonin has genuinely changed my life in regards to sleep. I'd tried everything and for exams went on Zopiclone, and then found the gold that is Melatonin. Thoroughly recommend anyone with suitable problems sleeping giving it a go. (I was DSPD, though every so often did the whole "Non-24-Hour-Sleep Disorder" thing)

How much do you take? I was regularly taking 3mg and 1.5mg regularly for most of the past 4 years. I recently tried 0.3mg (as recommended in another recent HN discussion about melatonin, I think it was a week or 2 ago), and I had terrible results.

On 1.5mg and 3mg, I would have very unsettling and memorable dreams, as well as wake up very tired, but I would get at least 7 hours of sleep on most nights. With 0.3mg, I woke after only 3 hours of sleep, feeling very energized but then getting very, very tired by early afternoon. I would fall asleep between 10 PM and midnight, wake up three hours later, then be unable to fall back asleep before it's time to go to work.

This meant I had to use stimulants to be functional, and I entered a cycle of not being able to sleep through the night, having to use stims in the morning, having to use melatonin at night to fall asleep, waking up after 3-4 hours, repeat. I finally broke it this past week by taking a sick day and sleeping through most of it, but I still couldn't hit 7 consecutive hours.

I can't even remember the last time I got the recommended minimum of 8 hours, regardless of what I do. I am trying ashwagandha and ZMA together for the first time tonight, having just taken both about an hour ago. I also took D3 this morning which will hopefully help too.

I think I'm done with melatonin for now, since I saw recommendations to abstain for a week or 2 to reset, and then trying again at the smaller dosage. But if this works, I probably won't use it again.

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