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Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

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Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#301

Post by kevin_b_er »

roel_v wrote: post #56

So I downloaded my facebook data a few days ago and there were no phone nrs in there, no call history, actually much less of everything than I thought they'd have. Are they lying to me or does this depend on other factors?

Because Facebook doesn't give you what they really know.

The download-your-data feature for a time showed the truth, in 2013: http://www.zdnet.com/article/firm-facebooks-shadow-profiles-...

So we may presume FB, especially in the US with little-to-no privacy laws against corporations, won't tell you what the really know.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#302

Post by lolc »

tlobes wrote: post #161
orbifold wrote: post #57

Ok, well this is just great. So Facebook has all my contacts from their aquisition of WhatsApp and even though I've never used any of their Apps or had an account with them, I'm pretty sure everyone I typically communicate with has the App and did not opt-out of this collection. So they get data on me for free that the police would need a court order to get. This kind of data retention has been highly controversial i…

Crazy thought. When a company with a ton of accumulated assets (data) craters, do the rules of bankruptcy and/or mitigating their losses to investors force them to just sell these assets outright? This may not happen in the next few decades with the likes of Facebook, but imagine what kind of data that much smaller companies have that will just be sold off to the highest bidder, possibly de-anonymized to increase it'…

> Does a user privacy contract hold any weight when a company is about to dissolve?

It would hold about the same weight as it does now: Effectively ignored.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#303

Post by kodablah »

OliverJones wrote: post #194
akuji1993 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still completely convinced that this whole scandal will not damage Facebook a bit, in the long term. Yeah, the stock is going to be a bit lower for some weeks, some people will leave, but the largest part of the Facebook users has not even realised the scandal in full scale. They're not going anywhere, they're going to continue as is, since there really is not alternative for Facebook right now and tbh they would…

> the largest part of the Facebook users has not even > realized the scandal in full scale. Exactly. That's why they must be regulated. Pharma companies, food companies, and airlines, to mention three, have the same sorts of characteristics in their businesses. Examples: Airlines have regulations because the typical user has no way to evaluate maintenance regimes or navigation procedures. The big information-hooverin…

> That's why they must be regulated.

I don't agree with GP's assessment that users "haven't realized" but I do agree that the "majority however won't care". So why regulate if a majority of people are ok with it? They're not too stupid, they just don't prioritize the way some here do. Doesn't have to be a law to force them to prioritize this way. This false equivalence to expertise of airplane mechanics is completely different in a security context and these kinds of analogies only help to make others want to dismiss the point quicker. You want to regulate transparency, ok. But if some accept these things, let them.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#304

Post by logfromblammo »

sametmax wrote: post #270
pbhjpbhj wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was probably autocorrect, but just FYI: en masse - it's from French, meaning something like, "in a large group". https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/en_masse

The irony is, I'm french, and I tried to "englishify" "en masse", thinking it made sense.

English is already partly French, thanks to the Normans. You can usually drop individual French words straight in without a problem, and sometimes short idiomatic phrases. Trying to translate will just shed any idiomatic character. En masse is already idiomatically associated with groups of people, whereas "in mass" makes us think in terms of kilograms.

How many tons of people are leaving Facebook now?

As another example, if you translated tete a tete into "head to head", those actually have slightly different meanings in English. Tete a tete translates idiomatically to "one on one", a private meeting of the minds, while "head to head" is a direct--usually public--confrontation or encounter, as one might find in a sporting match.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#305

Post by sametmax »

logfromblammo wrote: post #304
sametmax wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The irony is, I'm french, and I tried to "englishify" "en masse", thinking it made sense.

English is already partly French, thanks to the Normans. You can usually drop individual French words straight in without a problem, and sometimes short idiomatic phrases. Trying to translate will just shed any idiomatic character. En masse is already idiomatically associated with groups of people, whereas "in mass" makes us think in terms of kilograms. How many tons of people are leaving Facebook now? As another exa…

Voila, I learned the fact du jour. This makes my day, or my joie de vivre if I may say.

Do I do it right ?

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#306

Post by CodesInChaos »

austincheney wrote: post #147
ponderatul wrote: post #66

I think we are talking differently about this permission concept. Legally yes, they had permission. But the fact that they used those dark ux patterns to request that permission should not be forgotten. Even though legally they are in the right, we as users should make this fact irrelevant and just abandon the platform. Let them be right, let them win the argument but lose the battle with the general public.

There is nothing to suggest dark UX patterns were at play here. People simply gave Facebook access to everything because it was fashionable and convenient. People simply do not care about their privacy if its in conflict with convenience. It has been common knowledge for years that Facebook will directly use that data against you and still people, completely aware of this, didn't care. The only thing that made people…

> There is nothing to suggest dark UX patterns were at play here

https://techcrunch.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/opt-in_scr...

The no button is barely recognizable as button. But the No button is barely recognizable as a button and it and the explanation are gray on white, while the Yes button and misleading title are much more emphasized. And even half the explanation is bullshit like "better experience for everyone". Plenty dark UX in my book.

(Though I assume a lot of people would have agreed to this, even without the dubious UI)

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#307

Post by 908087 »

This kind of reminds me in a way of James Clapper's "least untruthful statement".

> He was asked directly, “Does the NSA collect any type of data at all on millions, or hundreds of millions of Americans?” There was no ambiguity or confusion and Clapper responded, “No, sir. … Not wittingly.” That was a lie and Clapper knew it when he said it. <

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#308

Post by logfromblammo »

sametmax wrote: post #305
logfromblammo wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

English is already partly French, thanks to the Normans. You can usually drop individual French words straight in without a problem, and sometimes short idiomatic phrases. Trying to translate will just shed any idiomatic character. En masse is already idiomatically associated with groups of people, whereas "in mass" makes us think in terms of kilograms. How many tons of people are leaving Facebook now? As another exa…

Voila, I learned the fact du jour. This makes my day, or my joie de vivre if I may say. Do I do it right ?

Yes. Those are all meaningful to native Anglophones. Those who learned English as a secondary language might have some trouble, though.

You could think of English as a contest between other languages, to see which one can get the biggest share of the etymology. French is one of the leaders. A lot of the core words come from Norman, but modern terms, particularly those drawn from cuisine and fashion, have made it in as well.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#310

Post by pishpash »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #165
pishpash wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are rooted utilities that do this, or allow you to spew fake data at those apps. That is, if you could unlock your bootloader and install the software you want. You should really blame phone manufacturers/carriers and Congress for giving you the privilege of paying for a piece of locked hardware that you don't own. They're only loaning you a billboard, after all, so what do you expect? Personally I wouldn't put…

> nor do I ever acquire unlockable devices. Do you mean non-unlockable?

Yes, that's what I meant!
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