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New FreeBSD Code of Conduct

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Re: New FreeBSD Code of Conduct

#131

Post by imsofuture »

voidr wrote: post #127
soyiuz wrote: post #73

I am always surprised at the backlash against such codes of conduct. One can point to numerous cases of harassment, abuse, and inequality in the tech community. Who is harmed by a stronger CoC? Let's discuss an example where CoC led to a negative outcome for some group.

Some of us don't want to be part of a community that ejects you for writing: " hug " Some of us just want to keep politics out of tech. We are probably the weirdos I guess.

"Keep politics out of tech" is extremely disingenuous.

This CoC can be summarized as "don't be a jerk to other people". I can't even fathom how that's a controversial or political statement, but yet, here we are.

Re: New FreeBSD Code of Conduct

#132

Post by ygaf »

imsofuture wrote: post #131
voidr wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of us don't want to be part of a community that ejects you for writing: " hug " Some of us just want to keep politics out of tech. We are probably the weirdos I guess.

"Keep politics out of tech" is extremely disingenuous. This CoC can be summarized as "don't be a jerk to other people". I can't even fathom how that's a controversial or political statement, but yet, here we are.

If the actual thing was summarized, it wouldn't be political. Instead it's sesame street time where we learn about systemic oppression.

Re: New FreeBSD Code of Conduct

#133

Post by 2trill2spill »

akerro wrote: post #125
soyiuz wrote: post #73

I am always surprised at the backlash against such codes of conduct. One can point to numerous cases of harassment, abuse, and inequality in the tech community. Who is harmed by a stronger CoC? Let's discuss an example where CoC led to a negative outcome for some group.

FreeBSD (and OpenBSD) has a lot of problems right now, and rewriting CoC makes me think they put effort into completely wrong places. Hey FreeBSD (and OpenBSD) developers have you patched spectre and meltdown already? Have you fixed your communication issues with security researchers who stopped notifying you of serious bugs? No? Oh I would hug you to cheer you up, but it's now allowed now.

> FreeBSD (and OpenBSD) has a lot of problems right now, and rewriting CoC makes me think they put effort into completely wrong places.

You realize people and projects can work on multiple things at once right?

> Hey FreeBSD (and OpenBSD) developers have you patched spectre and meltdown already?

The FreeBSD and OpenBSD developers were notified 6 months late and you expect them to magically have a patch ready.

> Have you fixed your communication issues with security researchers who stopped notifying you of serious bugs?

FreeBSD did nothing wrong to security researchers so there isn't anything to fix.

> Oh I would hug you to cheer you up, but it's now allowed now.

You sound like a wonderful person, not! Seriously the COC is to keep toxic people like you away.

Re: New FreeBSD Code of Conduct

#134

Post by akerro »

2trill2spill wrote: post #133
akerro wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FreeBSD (and OpenBSD) has a lot of problems right now, and rewriting CoC makes me think they put effort into completely wrong places. Hey FreeBSD (and OpenBSD) developers have you patched spectre and meltdown already? Have you fixed your communication issues with security researchers who stopped notifying you of serious bugs? No? Oh I would hug you to cheer you up, but it's now allowed now.

> FreeBSD (and OpenBSD) has a lot of problems right now, and rewriting CoC makes me think they put effort into completely wrong places. You realize people and projects can work on multiple things at once right? > Hey FreeBSD (and OpenBSD) developers have you patched spectre and meltdown already? The FreeBSD and OpenBSD developers were notified 6 months late and you expect them to magically have a patch ready. > Have…

>Seriously the COC is to keep toxic people like you away.

Then they did it right, I am most probably not going to donate to FreeBSD foundation first time in 5 years.

Re: New FreeBSD Code of Conduct

#135

Post by 2trill2spill »

akerro wrote: post #134
2trill2spill wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> FreeBSD (and OpenBSD) has a lot of problems right now, and rewriting CoC makes me think they put effort into completely wrong places. You realize people and projects can work on multiple things at once right? > Hey FreeBSD (and OpenBSD) developers have you patched spectre and meltdown already? The FreeBSD and OpenBSD developers were notified 6 months late and you expect them to magically have a patch ready. > Have…

>Seriously the COC is to keep toxic people like you away. Then they did it right, I am most probably not going to donate to FreeBSD foundation first time in 5 years.

> Then they did it right, I am most probably not going to donate to FreeBSD foundation first time in 5 years.

You must not care much about FreeBSD if a code of conduct saying don't be a asshole is what drove you to stop donating.

Also I'm skeptical you ever donated, you were spreading misinformation in you previous post about FreeBSD and now your mad they wrote a CoC that say things like don't threaten violence or stalk people.

Re: New FreeBSD Code of Conduct

#136

Post by 2trill2spill »

skookumchuck wrote: post #124
andrepd wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Badly. I for one am glad Bronze Age people had the brilliant idea to write down their laws, as I'm glad Romans and Byzantines decided to spread their legal system around.

I suspect we're the first to attempt to codify rude behavior.

> I suspect we're the first to attempt to codify rude behavior.

Many private groups have rules on good and bad behavior. There's simply nothing new about it.

Re: New FreeBSD Code of Conduct

#137

Post by 2trill2spill »

aap_ wrote: post #63
temprature wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given that there's groups of people railing against being told not to do the things on this list, yes, apparently.

Not liking being told what not to do does not imply that you want to actually do it though. Maybe I don't want to leave the house today, but that doesn't mean I will accept being locked up.

> Not liking being told what not to do does not imply that you want to actually do it though. Maybe I don't want to leave the house today, but that doesn't mean I will accept being locked up.

So you agree with the contents of the code of conduct but your not going to following them just to be difficult?

Re: New FreeBSD Code of Conduct

#138

Post by 2trill2spill »

ygaf wrote: post #97
aap_ wrote: post #10

This makes me sad. Do people really need to be told what not to do and say like that? To me it feels insulting that I am not trusted to be nice to others.

>Do people really need to be told what not to do and say like that? There isn't any evidence of it. On the other hand the language in the CoC itself is evidence that it comes from busybodies.

> On the other hand the language in the CoC itself is evidence that it comes from busybodies.

And just what evidence is that? You inferring something is not evidence.

Re: New FreeBSD Code of Conduct

#139

Post by cperciva »

jsiepkes wrote: post #54

There is a reason why laws are not drafted as specific as this code of conduct. If someone can think of another way of harassing then making "Harassing photography or recording, including logging online activity for harassment purposes" it's allowed? I doubt that's the intention. So why the oddly specific rules?

So why the oddly specific rules?

Not weirdly specific rules; weirdly specific examples. And the answer is "because these are things which have happened".

Re: New FreeBSD Code of Conduct

#140

Post by coldtea »

temprature wrote: post #85
coldtea wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or "anyone not familiar with the fashionable norms du jour, here's a list of potential thought crimes as derived by one country's culture (and its internal conflicts, cultural politics, and religious and post-religious baggage) and imposed on supposedly global communities".

In what country is it acceptable to not treat others with basic courtesy and respect? Which is really all the list is asking for.

Basic courtesy and respect doesn't need much of a list.

This is a long list of codified norms du jour to launch endless power micro-games and let attention-seeking holler than though people to run the show.

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