Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers • Hacker News Board

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#221

Post by lozaning » Sat, Mar 25, 2017, 11:43 PM UTC

BeetleB wrote: post #155

emodendroket wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that means that buying direct from Amazon can get you third party inventory.

>I don't think that means that buying direct from Amazon can get you third party inventory. I've sold on Amazon via FBA. Yes, it does. If you are selling a new item, you ship it to Amazon warehouses. Amazon informs you, the seller, that your item is not distinct from that of Amazon's or other sellers' FBA items. Inside their warehouse, it is just an item with no seller attached to it. If someone buys it, they just fi…

That's why you specify that you don't want your inventory comingled.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#222

Post by emodendroket » Sat, Mar 25, 2017, 11:47 PM UTC

Buge wrote: post #213

emodendroket wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The New York Times also did a big piece showing that these deals were almost always bad ones. The thing is that politicians have a simply ideological commitment to not intervene more directly.

The politicians do intervene directly >cities compete to offer the biggest tax So it would be actually better if they did less intervening, by not offering tax breaks to Amazon.

When I say "intervene directly" I mean more like directly employing people.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#223

Post by closeparen » Sat, Mar 25, 2017, 11:47 PM UTC

amsilprotag wrote: post #150

emodendroket wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is probably a calculation that the feds will be reticent to do that to an Amazon warehouse as they're generally major employers in the areas they're built in.

There was a great Bloomberg Decrypted podcast a couple weeks ago weighing the costs and benefits for a small town in offering a multi-million dollar subsidy for thousands of low-skill Amazon warehouse jobs. Is it really worth subsidizing at all when the government will have to fund various welfare programs to cover the difference between the ~$10.00/hr paid and a livable wage? But since towns compete and prestige is…

But they already have to pay welfare for those people, right? Or is Amazon bringing new low income residents?

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#224

Post by nommm-nommm » Sat, Mar 25, 2017, 11:48 PM UTC

zyxzkz wrote: post #175

ninv wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

8 out of 10 people cannot spot counterfeit goods. I bought a major brand perfume, Sold and fulfilled by Amazon. When i used it after 2 months i was suspicious a. One day i was in Macy's, saw the same perfume (on same price). I tried the tester and i realized that perfume at home is a cheap knock off. Initially i though that Amazon did not store it properly and warehouse heat must have destroyed the smell. Then i saw…

When I followed your link it says: Sold by MSP Sales LLC and Fulfilled by Amazon.

I don't know about that particular product but Amazon's inventory can go in and out of stock. Also they do not give themselves the buy box all the time, they do share it with third party sellers.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#225

Post by closeparen » Sat, Mar 25, 2017, 11:50 PM UTC

backtoyoujim wrote: post #145

binarymax wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's tens of millions of dollars in salaries injected into the local economy from one employer, not to mention the other additions like local taxes and utility spending. 1000 jobs is significant.

So we wait until 990 of those jobs are lost to automation ... then we order pitchforks from Amazon ?

Then Amazon can locate its facilities even farther from population centers where there is no municipal or even county government to speak of.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#226

Post by billpollock » Sat, Mar 25, 2017, 11:58 PM UTC

dec0dedab0de wrote: post #205

rkeene2 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait... So Amazon removed legitimate reviews from people who bought the product being sold on the page being reviewed because the product being sold is sometimes counterfeit ? How are other people attempting to purchase that item from that page supposed to learn that the item may sometimes be counterfeit and act in a rational way or with a correct risk assessment when valid data is being expunged without any other ch…

The valid 1 Star reviews should stay ! but those should be reviews of amazon, not reviews of the book.

One star reviews damning our book should stay, lowering the overall book review? How is that not blaming the victim? We're not the counterfeiters.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#227

Post by rebootthesystem » Sun, Mar 26, 2017, 12:03 AM UTC

Neliquat wrote: post #11

rebootthesystem wrote: post #9

It's worst than that. As someone already pointed out, buying software on Amazon is down-right dangerous. And Amazon does not care. Yet, beyond that, counterfeits and scams are rampant on the platform. Scammers take advantage of genuine seller's good rank, insert themselves at lower prices, destroy the genuine seller's revenue stream and deliver cheap knock-offs or even dangerous products to unsuspecting buyers. And p…

They penalize and hide non verified reviews mostly now unless super helpful.

The issue is that reviews affect ranking. And ranking can have a huge impact on sales. Attackers only have to get through a few times to create enough damage to require hundreds or thousands of 5 star reviews to fix. It's a matter of very simple math.

The only reviews that should be permitted should be from actual Amazon customers. They should also be weighted based on what I am going to call "karma". By this I mean that it should not be possible for someone to setup an account, buy a product and then leave a 1 star negative review within a few days.

We have seen reviews posted before the product was delivered to the buyer! In addition to this, the buyer's "karma" needs to have an element of seniority validation. Someone who has been on Amazon for ten years and regularly buys products is not likely to post face reviews. Someone who just joined Amazon 30 days ago and only bought a handful of products should not be trusted.

Non verified reviews should not be allowed at all. The key word here is "review", which should mean "I bought one, I used it for a reasonable period of time and this is what I think of the product.".

Reviews also need to have a certain amount of minimum time from purchase built in. Say, 30 days. And, within this time, sellers ought to have access to buyers in order to try and make it right. In other words, just like a Walmart customer would when buying something from the store and don't like it. There's an opportunity for excellent customer service here and Amazon is not allowing it to happen.

That's a review. An unverified review is a fairy tale. It's fake. And it can be fake both in a positive or negative direction.

Amazon needs to put in basic provisions in order to ensure that reviews are from actual buyers with enough "karma" to be trusted.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#228

Post by dogma1138 » Sun, Mar 26, 2017, 12:10 AM UTC

Apocryphon wrote: post #174

emodendroket wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The New York Times also did a big piece showing that these deals were almost always bad ones. The thing is that politicians have a simply ideological commitment to not intervene more directly.

Makes me wonder if political deals to bring in military-industrial complex jobs at military bases and arms manufacturing plants and the like are any better. They at least provide better compensation to the workers, right?

Towns like to attract military bases because they bring in a large population that is employed requires no loca services (since it's handled by the armed forces), usually well behaved which spends its income locally. Bases also bring 100s of civilian jobs and support local businesses.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#229

Post by lozaning » Sun, Mar 26, 2017, 12:11 AM UTC

cookiecaper wrote: post #60

new299 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ubiuiti products seem really nice. However I've heard many bad things about their management culture. I really don't get how you can get fake product into you own fulfillment chain. But I guess if you sign off on fake invoices that could happen. :)

I'm assuming it happened when buying from their FBA store. That would happen because they didn't tick the box preventing Amazon from commingling inventory and someone else listed a fake "Ubiquiti router".

Just listing it wouldn't have been enough. The counterfeiter would have had to ship product to amazon through FBA.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#230

Post by unclebucknasty » Sun, Mar 26, 2017, 12:14 AM UTC

bonestamp2 wrote: post #72

Lasher wrote: post #4

I purchased Quickbooks Pro 2017 (PC) on Amazon last week, said it was "sold by Intuit" so wasn't even supposed to be an FBA (fulfilled by Amazon). Figured if it costs no more I might as well get the physical disk. What showed up was a DVD case with a very clearly photocopied cover for a Mac version with a Verbatim CDR inside and a hacked version of the software. Amazon processed the refund just fine but didn't seem p…

Amazon isn't going to take this seriously until a major company gets burned and the FBI gets involved. Then Amazon will experience what every other company does that gets burned for selling counterfeit goods... the FBI will raid their warehouse and hold all the inventory as evidence until they complete their investigation. Like you said, Amazon doesn't seem concerned that they're selling counterfeit goods -- probably…

>until a major company gets burned and the FBI gets involved.

Or until consumers start to become unsure enough about whether they are getting legit goods on Amazon that they become wary of shopping there.

>they don't understand that's a serious crime.

Oh, they understand this well. They are a multi-billion dollar company with teams of lawyers.

But, as long as they can get away with a passive response--like processing refunds when requested--without taking too much of a reputational or legal hit, they will continue to do so. Effectively, it's cheaper to outsource the policing to customers vs. trying to vet vendors at scale.