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Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

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Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#71

Post by mtreis86 »

Counterfeiting is an old problem. Straight razors were being counterfeited in the 1800's. They had a number of interesting patterns to counter it. Stamping of the company logo could be changed regularly. Certain groups were the only ones allowed to sell under specific companies. Some razors (GW Pipes for instance) were so well made that counterfeits were fairly obvious. But, some counterfeits were just about as well made as the real product. This is still an issue with those razors, as so many thousands of counterfeits were produced, that determining the authenticity is quite a process.

To link this back in to the original comment, I bought what was clearly a counterfeited Spyderco directly from amazon. They didn't seem to care, but did refund me. (The knife sharpened extremely easily - VG10 is a tough stringy steel that takes more than normal effort to hone)

I won't buy new knives from anyone but the manufacturer anymore.

Edit for clarity: Most fakes were unstamped or generic Solingen/Sheffield stamps. Most branded razors pre1900 are authentic. Only a percent or two of those produced were fake. Still makes authentication difficult. And to make it even weirder, some fakes were actually better made than the brand they were being sold as!

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#72

Post by bonestamp2 »

Lasher wrote: post #4

I purchased Quickbooks Pro 2017 (PC) on Amazon last week, said it was "sold by Intuit" so wasn't even supposed to be an FBA (fulfilled by Amazon). Figured if it costs no more I might as well get the physical disk. What showed up was a DVD case with a very clearly photocopied cover for a Mac version with a Verbatim CDR inside and a hacked version of the software. Amazon processed the refund just fine but didn't seem p…

Amazon isn't going to take this seriously until a major company gets burned and the FBI gets involved. Then Amazon will experience what every other company does that gets burned for selling counterfeit goods... the FBI will raid their warehouse and hold all the inventory as evidence until they complete their investigation. Like you said, Amazon doesn't seem concerned that they're selling counterfeit goods -- probably because they don't understand that's a serious crime.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#73

Post by malandrew »

phil21 wrote: post #21
dmix wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't the review system help deal with this problem? I always check reviews of the product and vendor to make sure it's legit. Only a few could get burned before the vendor is flagged as a counterfeiter which would stop further purchases. That should reduce the amount of money you could make scamming people and make it a less viable criminal business. Amazon also seems diligent in refunding people as well. So the sol…

The problem is that it can say "Sold by Amazon" and still be co-mingled stock some third party seller tossed the same SKU on. So there is no way to even know who the actual seller is. Amazon could end this particular fraud literally overnight by no longer co-mingling, but I suspect that would be wildly expensive for them to do. Your method is fine for actual accounts selling scammy things - the problem is when those…

They could comingle and still solve the problems whenever they get stock from a seller they slap on an Amazon barcode that identifies both the UPC and the Amazon seller. That information gets included in the purchase details and when problems are identified with a product they pull those products and identify people who got the bad product. To cover the cost of that problem they can require sellers to insure their product or put down a deposit to cover the cost of a recall.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#74

Post by ArtDev »

robotjosh wrote: post #19
Lasher wrote: post #4

I purchased Quickbooks Pro 2017 (PC) on Amazon last week, said it was "sold by Intuit" so wasn't even supposed to be an FBA (fulfilled by Amazon). Figured if it costs no more I might as well get the physical disk. What showed up was a DVD case with a very clearly photocopied cover for a Mac version with a Verbatim CDR inside and a hacked version of the software. Amazon processed the refund just fine but didn't seem p…

I bought a phone battery on amazon. Looked legit, was the top result for my phone. It was counterfeit and wouldn't work. I don't even know how to get a battery because the phone stores didn't have it anymore. Can't trust amazon.

Same thing happened to me.

The funny thing is that the Samsung website sends you an Amazon seller.

I noticed this the second time I needed a battery. The batteries look identical. The only difference was that the counterfeit battery only lasted a couple months.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#75

Post by Lasher »

eeeeeeeeeeeee wrote: post #52
Lasher wrote: post #4

I purchased Quickbooks Pro 2017 (PC) on Amazon last week, said it was "sold by Intuit" so wasn't even supposed to be an FBA (fulfilled by Amazon). Figured if it costs no more I might as well get the physical disk. What showed up was a DVD case with a very clearly photocopied cover for a Mac version with a Verbatim CDR inside and a hacked version of the software. Amazon processed the refund just fine but didn't seem p…

I don't even buy from any third party sellers, including fulfilled by Amazon, for this reason. Amazons response has been wholly inadequate thus far. Brands are destroyed because people get counterfeit crap and review the entire product/brand. Why can't Amazon show the merchant used for every review and let people aggregate the reviews of each product by the merchant and product? Right now you have to check the overal…

Right, I make a point of avoiding 'FBA' sellers on Amazon, this one was listed 'Sold by Intuit' but what I received was (I hope) a co-mingled inventory item that was counterfeit and, in the case of software, possibly downright dangerous had I tried to install it.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#76

Post by billpollock »

Lasher wrote: post #15
dmix wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't the review system help deal with this problem? I always check reviews of the product and vendor to make sure it's legit. Only a few could get burned before the vendor is flagged as a counterfeiter which would stop further purchases. That should reduce the amount of money you could make scamming people and make it a less viable criminal business. Amazon also seems diligent in refunding people as well. So the sol…

You get to review the product but when the sourcing is all thrown together all you're really doing is dragging down the rating for the overall product (Quickbooks 2017 in this case) and not the source of the specific item you were shipped. My issue had nothing to do with the product itself although I suppose if enough 1 star reviews start to build up then Intuit and other larger publishers that might actually have so…

That's correct. One issue we've faced is that people will give the counterfeits one-star although most people reviewing the book give it four or five stars. That just ends up hurting us unfortunately. It took Amazon over three months to remove those one star reviews from one of our counterfeited books.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#77

Post by p49k »

aisofteng wrote: post #37

You know those electronics stores littered around Manhattan that sell flip cell phones for like $10, calling cards, and $15 digital cameras that nobody shops at because it's so obvious what you're getting? Why does it seem like people lose their sense online? If you're not buying from the manufacturer or a seller you're familiar with, do some research. And don't buy from anywhere outside the Western world. The rest o…

I was under the impression that items "Sold and shipped by Amazon" were actually purchased by Amazon as well, which would imply quality control (for example, I don't expect Amazon to buy Apple products from anyone other than Apple). I don't think that's an unreasonable expectation, yet I learned from this thread that it's not the case.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#78

Post by Lasher »

justinpombrio wrote: post #26
Lasher wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You get to review the product but when the sourcing is all thrown together all you're really doing is dragging down the rating for the overall product (Quickbooks 2017 in this case) and not the source of the specific item you were shipped. My issue had nothing to do with the product itself although I suppose if enough 1 star reviews start to build up then Intuit and other larger publishers that might actually have so…

> My issue had nothing to do with the product itself You sound hesitant, but I don't think you should be. Your issue has to do with the product you received after clicking "buy" on an amazon product page. That page may say Quickbooks 2017 from Intuit, but there's no necessary relationship between what the page says and what you're buying, and when they're different you should rate what you were sold.

I totally get your point, my concern is someone deciding that Quickbooks Pro (or whatever product) is not a good product because I was shipped something that doesn't even resemble the product. No love lost for Intuit here for other reasons but still doesn't seem right.

With no way to differentiate between product and product supplier then you're right, the review page really the only outlet I have.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#79

Post by emodendroket »

JangoSteve wrote: post #68
eeeeeeeeeeeee wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't even buy from any third party sellers, including fulfilled by Amazon, for this reason. Amazons response has been wholly inadequate thus far. Brands are destroyed because people get counterfeit crap and review the entire product/brand. Why can't Amazon show the merchant used for every review and let people aggregate the reviews of each product by the merchant and product? Right now you have to check the overal…

> I don't even buy from any third party sellers, including fulfilled by Amazon, for this reason. Except, according from the information in the article, this doesn't matter: > Shipped and sold by Amazon.com means that the product is shipped and sold by Amazon Retail (via Vendor Central or Vendor Express) directly. Basically, the manufacturer sends product to Amazon.com at a set price through a traditional PO process.…

I don't think that means that buying direct from Amazon can get you third party inventory.

Re: Amazon's Tepid Response to Counterfeiters Frustrates Sellers

#80

Post by kveykva »

new299 wrote: post #30

Counterfeit products seem to becoming a near universal problem. It's not just amazon, but other marketplaces (eBay, taobao etc). Even seems like major electronic component suppliers fall foul of this sometimes (digikey). I can really only see three solutions: 1. We just buy everything direct from the supplier. Companies like amazon manage distribution. 2. We provide tools to allow the consumer to track the supply cha…

This is actually exactly what our company (assembly.com - YCS15) does.

We're now at the stage where we provide effectively a full supply chain solution. It works like this:

1. Product company has an issue like this and contacts us

2. We work with the factory, setup our quality control hardware+software.

3. The product company defines all of the procedures for validating that a product works and is legitimate. All of those are performed by our team on the China side. Individual units are serialized with QR codes and photographed and videoed during inspections.

The combination of unique QR in our system and natural markings on products is usually enough to validate authenticity. We have a few other systems we use to further validate the product, but on a high level and as the most cost effective part of our solution, this already helps far more than doing nothing.

We've helped prevent a large amount of fraud that was previously occurring for some customers. Interesting to see this start to become a larger issue on Amazon's side.

4. We're currently working on moving the serialization and validation to more steps in the supply chain, continuing to validate authenticity + quality closer and closer to the customer.

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