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Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results 2017

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Re: Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results 2017

#111

Post by yulaow »

paradite wrote: post #82
yulaow wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Outside of US, very few people use macs compared to you. Here in euw even in a CS course, engineering class in a top university or hackathon in a big startup incubator I can see like 1 macbook every 30 standard notebooks. Reason is simple: they are very overpriced for ours salaries (and I am in a first world country, I think their costs are prohibitive in places like India/Cina/etc) and - personal reason - as a webde…

The situation is entirely the other way round here in Singapore (for the younger generation). I used to run Linux on a laptop, but eventually I gave up and switched to Macbook so that I don't have to deal with drivers and low-level config issues on a daily basis. In my university, 60%-70% of CS students use a Macbook. They are not working or attending conferences yet, so the change is going to take some time.

Singapore is the 3rd state for GDP per capita, I bet buying a macbook is not seen as "oh I have to invest on it almost two month of my pay" in that area

Just for comparison, with what I should spend for a macbook here I would pay 3 years of a Bachelor Degree + half a year of a Master Degree (obviously I am referring to just university tuition costs, not rent or other general expenses) in a top 3 university of my country with international recognition.

Re: Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results 2017

#112

Post by Pharylon »

flurdy wrote: post #56

43% prefer tabs? Get out! [ http://stackoverflow.com/insights/survey/2017/#work-tabs-or-... ]

I use spaces exclusively, but only because everyone else does. Tabs are clearly superior, since their width can be adjusted to look however you like. For instance, I prefer 4 spaces of indentation in Javascript. Another developer here prefers 2. With tabs, we could both be happy.

Re: Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results 2017

#113

Post by mbel »

tannhaeuser wrote: post #103
serg_chernata wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tabs are far superior. :)

This is the correct answer. The bad developer is identified by the rhythmic noise of arrow keys.

How arrow keys are related to tab/space flamewar? Isn't everybody (whose job requires typing) using moving between words as the most basic mean of navigation? (w, M-f, Ctrl+arrow, etc.)

Re: Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results 2017

#114

Post by yosamino »

tannhaeuser wrote: post #103
serg_chernata wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tabs are far superior. :)

This is the correct answer. The bad developer is identified by the rhythmic noise of arrow keys.

... because they aren't using an editor coughvimcough that correctly positions their cursor automatically or let's them jump to the beginning of a line with a single keystroke ?

Re: Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results 2017

#116

Post by ihsw2 »

justaman wrote: post #105
tclancy wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course it is. Homogeneity is dangerous for an ecosystem and even if it weren't, not all apps, websites, products of code are consumed by straight white guys living on the US coasts. A mix of perspectives is a healthy thing.

I like to think that since white guys are generally the most universally hated group by other race\gender combo's, white guys just dont really care who you are as long as you get the job done. Thats why they have the lowest interest in diversity.

That's blatantly racist.

Re: Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results 2017

#117

Post by sremani »

Baeocystin wrote: post #94
douche wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

StackOverflow is more tilted towards "dark matter developers"[1] than many other places - the unseen, the unheralded, those that are toiling away at LOB apps inside of companies. Often they're using PHP or Java or C#, or god help them, Visual Basic, still. Those are not necessarily the kind of people that are going to be seen at dev conferences, but there is a huge number of them, and they use StackOverflow hard. [1]…

Heh. Two of my clients are still using VB Apps I wrote for them in VB6. I'm not ashamed. They work, and they've worked well for 12+ years, with only the most minor of updates. Not every business follows the 'innovate fast and break things' mold. Thankfully.

Exactly, we should be proud of creating Software that works and works great. Not the languages we develop in. The one main lesson if there is I learnt from 13 years of development is, keep the dev stack boring!

Re: Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results 2017

#118

Post by inanutshellus »

kbart wrote: post #57
SiVal wrote: post #14

I'm surprised to see "platforms" as Win: 41%, Desktop Linux: 33%, Mac: 18.4%. Presumably this question was about the machine you use to develop software on. The reason I'm surprised has nothing to do with any advocacy. It's just that whenever I look around at a non-Apple dev conference in the US (Web, for example), it looks as though fewer than 1/5 of the machines are NON-Macs, while the answer to the question above…

Developers that attend conferences in USA are very small and biased subset of total developers worldwide. For vast majority of developers attending a conference in USA would cost few to several months worth of salary, so it's no brainer. Not to mention bullish USA border controls that makes people (especially non-white) think twice before traveling. I haven't seen many developers using Macs outside of USA and few Wes…

FWIW, in this survey I would've answered "Linux Desktop", but at a conference you'd see me on a MacBook. Not everyone uses the thing they bring to a conference as their workstation. :)

Re: Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results 2017

#119

Post by rejschaap »

parroquiano wrote: post #77
m0sa wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problematic ones are the 19.3% who prefer both...

On the contrary, those of us who prefer both are the smart ones[0] [0] https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/SmartTabs

That's too complicated for the unwashed masses

Re: Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results 2017

#120

Post by wtetzner »

OJFord wrote: post #98
TorKlingberg wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, strange, I rarely encounter codebases with tabs. I wonder if some of them mean they press the tab key and the editor adds spaces.

> strange, I rarely encounter codebases with tabs I prefer tabs, but I never use them. It's like social networks, it doesn't matter what you prefer, it matters what your friends prefer. If 57% prefer spaces, well okay I suppose we're using spaces then.

I think the problem with tabs is that you inevitably end up using both tabs and spaces. This still OK, as long as tabs are used for indentation, and spaces for alignment. But if you don't have good editor support for it, you'll end up with some lines indented using tabs, and some indented using spaces.

So while in theory tabs are superior, in practice they seem to end up being more trouble that they're worth.

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