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Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

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Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#381

Post by 1_2__3 »

edblarney wrote: post #194
gaff33 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They talk about it in the article > People from foreign backgrounds are suspected of crimes more often than people from a Swedish background [...] In a later study, researchers at Stockholm University showed that the main difference in terms of criminal activity between immigrants and others in the population was due to differences in the socioeconomic conditions in which they grew up in Sweden. So it seems that whil…

"the main difference in terms of criminal activity between immigrants and others in the population was due to differences in the socioeconomic conditions in which they grew up in Sweden." This is a classic red-herring. 'They were poor therefore they have bad behaviours'. The failure of the logic is the assumption of correlation/causation. One might argue that 'bad behaviour will lead one to being poor'. I have no dou…

> In the US - people are far more gregarious and open personally.

Can I just share my belief that this is polite fiction? It's certainly the view of America that we Americans have for ourselves, but can you honestly say you see evidence of it in day-to-day-life - and can you compare it to western Europe?

In my personal experience no, EU migrants are no more marginalized than they are here, and no, American migrants are no more "integrated". Vast swaths of SoCal and Texas is basically Mexico. Huge parts of Florida are basically Cuba. The Somali influx in Minnesota is real and highly separated from the rest of white society there. You don't need to look for ghettos to find large areas of extremely insular immigrants, often 2nd or 3rd generation still with no intention of or interest in immigrating in any sense other than physical location.

I'm not even commenting on if it's a good or bad thing, but ultimately I don't think we've EVER been the melting pot we claim to be, certainly the evidence around us doesn't suggest we are.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#382

Post by [deleted] »

rndgermandude wrote: post #227
freeflight wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The point is that a majority of all violence and sexual crimes is performed by immigrants Source please? Because the available data, at least for Germany, does not support this claim at all. Latest BKA report from first quarter of 2016 puts the amount of "offenses against sexual self-determination" for migrants at 1.10%. [1] As somebody who's lived over 10 years right next to Bavaria's biggest initial reception cent…

Not attempting to prove the grandparent right (because they are not), but the 1.1% figure is misleading. It's the portion of migrant crimes that are sex crimes, not the portion of sex crimes committed by migrants of the all sex crimes.

[deleted]

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#383

Post by DarkKomunalec »

k_swden wrote: post #377

It's not unlikely that migrants coming from a less educated background choose to settle in highly segregated area as they likelier to opt to live closer to their country men. The problem with this is very obvious, many have problem learning the language, norms and fail to gain useful knowledge about their new modern society and what's worse is their children is in the same trap and the result is poor education, pover…

"This failure of integration, to build a modern, cohesive and beneficial culture for everyone, is common in the west..."

That is because immigration from very different cultures is only common in the west. Other countries either don't attract immigrants from far off, or actively disallow their permanent residence (e.g. China and Japan).

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#384

Post by [deleted] »

Pxtl wrote: post #289
scribu wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd like to think that HN can host civil, fact-based discussions about sensitive issues like these. If it can't, then perhaps the community isn't that special after all.

Staying away from this kind of subject is part of what makes HN special.

[deleted]

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#385

Post by SamBam »

Exofunctor wrote: post #372
AlexTelon wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The quote was: "In a later study, researchers at Stockholm University showed that the main difference in terms of criminal activity between immigrants and others in the population was due to differences in the socioeconomic conditions in which they grew up in Sweden." That means that the most important factor in terms of criminal activity is that immigrants are largely poor and poor commit more crimes. Not that rich…

The point is that most of these immigrants are poor, correspondingly prone to crime, and therefore not the sort of people you want to blast into your tiny population by the tens of thousands. Things are also confounded by the fact that most of these people are heavily theologically indoctrinated, making social integration and upward mobility effectively impossible, so they're going to stay poor.

> Things are also confounded by the fact that most of these people are heavily theologically indoctrinated, making social integration and upward mobility effectively impossible

This is when your biases are walking uninvited into a discussion about data.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#386

Post by ng12 »

oytis wrote: post #371
ng12 wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you just refer to sexual assault as a business?

No, but the logic in the same. People closer to the bottom of social hierarchy are more prone to sexual assaults. Immigrants just occupied social niche that was previosly occupied by poorest locals.

And your argument is that the poor locals became less poor after the immigrants started arriving?

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#387

Post by TillE »

kyleblarson wrote: post #348
piva00 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, not like that at the fucking all. I live in Stockholm, I just came today to my home from a friend's place that is in one of these pesky little maps marking it as a "no-go zone". Seriously, there's nothing alarming there at all, it's a very normal area a little bit outside the center with more affordable housing (compared to the center of Stockholm but not even near "cheap") and that's about it. I've stayed on tha…

Honest question, not trying to troll. Would you be comfortable walking in those neighborhoods wearing a yamaka or holding hands with / displaying affection to a member of the same sex?

If you can't even spell yarmulke, maybe you shouldn't be using antisemitism as a concern-trolling weapon.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#388

Post by joshuahedlund »

oligopoly wrote: post #97
otalp wrote: post #23

According to the official statistics on The Swedish Crime Survey, the sexual violence rate in Sweden remained about the same between 2005 and 2014. The refugee crisis began around 2014, and since then, the rates for sexual violence went down in 2015[1] something you never see mentioned on certain parts of the internet. 2016 saw an increase in crimes, but still less than pre-immigration levels in 2014. Also the Swedis…

Most of the crimes in Sweden is done by immigrants. Sweden is the rape capital of Europe. It's creepy to see this kind of behaviour condoned and labeled as nothing. Sweden: Rape Capital of the West https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5195/sweden-rape Everything is factual in that statement but seems to burst some peoples bubble.

Sweden's definition of rape and the way they count them is much more inclusive than other countries, so it is not valid to compare statistics across countries. See http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-39056786

> if a person comes to the police and reports being raped by a partner or husband every day for the past year, the police will record each of these events. In many other countries these incidents would be recorded just once: one victim, one type of crime and one record.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#389

Post by ZeroGravitas »

partisan wrote: post #369
ZeroGravitas wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can use them any way you want, just be aware when you do that some people think Dearborn in Michigan, or Birmingham in the UK are currently no-go areas for anyone who is not a conservative muslim, so any mention of Sharia which isn't a condemnation basically means you approve of this scenario and are part of the conspiracy to bring down the west. And this conspiracy goes right to the top. The current president of…

You keep alluding to what other people will think if the topics are discussed. I am asking you if there is a context in which these topics are open to discussion without judgement and categorization? Can we have a discussion of Sharia that is both critical and allowed? Can I be critical of it and not be a conspiracy theorist and not be a Trump supporter? P.S. Where can I find the full list of topics not to be discuss…

Ah, you caught me out. I was only pretending when I said "You can use them any way you want". In fact you're not allowed to discuss any topics. You seem to interpret everything anyone says as an attempt to censor you, so it will only be fruitless and aggravating for people to attempt to converse with you in good faith anyway.

Everyone else though, will be aware that words can have unexpected connotations, like the use of the word "thugs" or "religious freedom" or "globalist bankers" in modern american politics, and can adjust accordingly.

Re: Facts about migration and crime in Sweden

#390

Post by Exofunctor »

SamBam wrote: post #385
Exofunctor wrote: post #372

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point is that most of these immigrants are poor, correspondingly prone to crime, and therefore not the sort of people you want to blast into your tiny population by the tens of thousands. Things are also confounded by the fact that most of these people are heavily theologically indoctrinated, making social integration and upward mobility effectively impossible, so they're going to stay poor.

> Things are also confounded by the fact that most of these people are heavily theologically indoctrinated, making social integration and upward mobility effectively impossible This is when your biases are walking uninvited into a discussion about data.

Pointing out that religious fundamentalists don't integrate well is not a good example of "bias".
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