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H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

economist.com

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Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#231

Post by planetjones »

anjc wrote: post #97

>Although it is true that foreign workers at the Indian consultancies receive more visas than higher-skilled workers at better-known firms, a simple solution exists. Congress could raise the number of visas issued. Given that the unemployment rate for college graduates sits at 2.5%, it is fair to say that most native workers displaced by H-1Bs land on their feet. Absolute scum. Native workers displaced by H1Bs is ok…

Truly terrible, but consistent with the Economist. I don't want to bring Trump into every comment; but with "solutions" like this floating around and decision making based on an unemployment statistic - not happiness, job fulfilment, job challenge or job earning potential - you can really see why he picked up the votes.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#232

Post by virmundi »

jackgolding wrote: post #126
calvinbhai wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Americans have many better options than IT to make a good living. Many of those options though, are slowly getting eaten up by tech (Amazon, Walmart - Jet) In India, IT sector escaped the clutches of red tape, and thrived. So it became a very good option to make a living.

For those who don't have the equity required to invest in a medical or legal education - what are those options? I'd imagine banking is largely based on what school you attend.

You might not need the equity to invest in a medical degree, aside from cost of living and some pre-med catchup. Many states offer free medical education if you are willing to serve an underprivileged population for 5 years. I researched for a bit. Parts of Indianapolis, a fairly metropolitan city, count as under served. I don't think you get cost of living, but you might be able to find a similar grant that pairs with the free schooling.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#233

Post by raitom »

donald123 wrote: post #228
baby wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Get a job with an employer willing to start green card process immediately (many will be willing since it means no uncertainity of H1b lottery) Good luck finding such an employer when you're fresh out of school. Also, a greencard takes ages to process.

A greencard takes ages to process only for Indians and Mainland Chinese. Not for other countries.

At least 1 year, which is ages for an employer.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#234

Post by oh_sigh »

shas3 wrote: post #195
loph wrote: post #103

This one sentence says it all: "The Economist found that between 2012 and 2015 the three biggest Indian outsourcing firms—TCS, Wipro and Infosys—submitted over 150,000 visa applications for positions that paid a median salary of $69,500. In contrast, America’s five biggest tech firms—Apple, Amazon, Facebook, Google and Microsoft—submitted just 31,000 applications, and proposed to pay their workers a median salary of…

Uh? SD is a super-generic title. H1B pool can include disproportionate number of fresh graduates (BS or MS) because OPT program gives them the flexibility to wait till April comes around to file for H1B. It is almost impossible (with exceptions for researchers and multinational managers/ O1/O2/L1) to hire experienced people from outside the US via H1B. Thus this skewing happens: more jobs for fresh graduates probably…

Why would we need H1Bs for fresh graduates, unless they are graduates in some very niche speciality (maybe machine learning?). Aren't H1Bs for skilled workers where they can't find an American equivalent? Is it really the case that there aren't enough fresh American grads graduating every year?

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#235

Post by shas3 »

oh_sigh wrote: post #234
shas3 wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh? SD is a super-generic title. H1B pool can include disproportionate number of fresh graduates (BS or MS) because OPT program gives them the flexibility to wait till April comes around to file for H1B. It is almost impossible (with exceptions for researchers and multinational managers/ O1/O2/L1) to hire experienced people from outside the US via H1B. Thus this skewing happens: more jobs for fresh graduates probably…

Why would we need H1Bs for fresh graduates, unless they are graduates in some very niche speciality (maybe machine learning?). Aren't H1Bs for skilled workers where they can't find an American equivalent? Is it really the case that there aren't enough fresh American grads graduating every year?

1. Undergrads who are exceptional in one field: Imagine applying this "undergrads aren't skilled workers" to Linus Trovalds in 1990.

2. Masters students with specialized skills and possible prior experience before their Masters.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#236

Post by reloop »

0xfeba wrote: post #146
loph wrote: post #103

This one sentence says it all: "The Economist found that between 2012 and 2015 the three biggest Indian outsourcing firms—TCS, Wipro and Infosys—submitted over 150,000 visa applications for positions that paid a median salary of $69,500. In contrast, America’s five biggest tech firms—Apple, Amazon, Facebook, Google and Microsoft—submitted just 31,000 applications, and proposed to pay their workers a median salary of…

Yup. I've said it before[1][2] and people just kept replying "Oh but we hire them for their talent, therefore everyone does." I work at a run of the mill SaaS company. We have 60% H-1Bs devs here as contractors from a certain contracting company (more in QA). They live paycheck to paycheck. I get paid, literally, twice as much (I've seen the H-1B Labor Condition Applications for ones we hire directly--The contracting…

I dislike poor working and visa condition as much as, if not more than, anyone else. But other than that I don't really see the problem. You're saying that the people you're hiring aren't particularly talented and get payed less. Not everyone can go to the right school, learn the right languages and get accepted to companies that pay $100k with perks.

It sound like, other than fixing some of the things with H-1B, what really should happen is some sort of easier O (-1A) visa with mainly a salary requirement.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#237

Post by cmdrfred »

thewhitetulip wrote: post #229
cmdrfred wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>invest more into education I suggest the opposite. The reason college tuition is so high is because the government backs those loans. Remove the government backing of loans thus lessening the availability of capitol to the educational system and I think you will find it will become vastly more affordable.

I am in India and the govt doesn't back any student loan yet college tuitions have ridiculously skyrocketed, heck, I paied less for my one yr college tuition than qhat my cousin is paying for his daughter's playgroup (I paid 50k INR for 1yr tuition and my neice's playgeoup charges 75k INR, don't know what the fuck they teach)

That's less than $800 US isn't it? To compare a year of school here probably averages 10K USD a year or 668,325 INR.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#238

Post by CodeSheikh »

Why don't we just stop accepting visa applications from Indian outsourcing firms—TCS, Wipro and Infosys for one year and see how it unfolds? It will resolve the ongoing debate -- at lease prove it one way or another. From a candidate's point of view, I am all in for finding new opportunities in a foreign prosperous land. But gaming the system is not great for the local US economy. Maybe having a new visa category with temp status and easy renewals every six-months. If those candidates are good enough, they can easily find regular H1-B jobs with regular American companies. Some foreigners spend a lot of money and go through severe hardships to get educated at American universities adhering to American socio-economic values. If they are good enough, they get hired by American companies with regular pays. I think it is unfair for them to get categorized under the same blanket rhetoric of "Abusing of H1-B visas".

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#239

Post by refurb »

throwaway100217 wrote: post #230

I am on an H1-B work authorization. The company applied for my position with a salary of ~$100K/yr (on the LCA and the H1 application) but they actually paid me ~$240K/yr. This year and the next, it will be well north of $300-$330K/yr. Why would they do this? Simple - to be able to pay me a prevailing wage and keep me in status in case the shit hits the fan. If they applied to the government saying they'd pay me $240…

My actual salary will never be reported in an H1 database.

The company has to report your actual salary. That's what in this database: http://h1bdata.info/

It's not prevailing wage, it's actual base pay.

I can remember at a previous employer that when you file for an H1-B, the company has to post the information in a public place. The form states the prevailing wage and the actual base salary.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#240

Post by pinaceae »

gaius wrote: post #187
pinaceae wrote: post #148

yes, and it's filling shit jobs that no American CS grad wants to do. who wants to do outsourced QA for Oracle? menial, mind numbing clicky work. who wants to maintain monster codebases built 20 years ago for some internal bullshit system at a Fortune 500? most of Software work by now is akin to facilities management. hence you give it to motivated foreigners, just like in farming, etc.

For a decent salary, lots of people. Do the 9-5 and spend the rest of the time on hobbies or with family. And why not?

simply not true.

become a hiring manager and you'll see.

you don't even get applications for those jobs by American CS grads or professionals - before any salary numbers are in play.

we run analysis in our HR pipeline trackers - remove Asians and Eastern Europeans and its crickets.

walk into Google, Facebook, Salesforce offices and see for yourself.

i know this is super unpopular on HN were everyone is a superstar coder, but facts are fact. 90% of software work is undesirable and unfulfilling - and Westerners feel entitled to life-changing work.

I just had a 26 year-old US coder quit because he does not want to come to work every day anymore, he now wants to travel Nepal and do something radical. Great for him - while a 1000 less-fortunate-by- birthplace people would give a leg for his job.

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