Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

bloomberg.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

311–320 of 372 posts

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#311

Post by eva1984 »

sytelus wrote: post #293
blacktulip wrote: post #68

As a Chinese I would say that the points in this article, though true, are not among the driving reasons. If you ask me, I would present this list: 1. Practically, there are only 4-5 cities suitable for 'tech talents' in China. The properties prices in these cities are comparable to the ones in NY and SF while the salary isn't. BTW: you have very little chance to be able to get married without a property under your n…

How much is race or religion factor as well? I'd read somewhere that it is nearly impossible to immigrate to East Asian country if at least one of your parent wasn't native born of that country. The laws around citizenship simply doesn't allow that. In some East Asian countries (perhaps Japan?), someone outsider can't get citizenship even if married to citizen of that country. Wouldn't lack of long term future preven…

True.

China, or PRC, has issued fewer than 2000 green cards to foreigners every since its foundation, and most of them are issued to people who have Chinese ancestry.

Race. Chinese people are pretty...racist to TBH. But if you are White, it is probably going to benefit you. Good luck if you are people of colors. People hate PC here, but you will hate China for zero PC as well. A part that I really don't like about China, is a lot of people seem to judge others like it is their own damn rights, unacceptable.

Religion. Not really a lot people care, not even the government does, if you just practice yourself. But you are openly advocating about that, people will frown upon you, and will keep you distance.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#312

Post by lacampbell »

sytelus wrote: post #293
blacktulip wrote: post #68

As a Chinese I would say that the points in this article, though true, are not among the driving reasons. If you ask me, I would present this list: 1. Practically, there are only 4-5 cities suitable for 'tech talents' in China. The properties prices in these cities are comparable to the ones in NY and SF while the salary isn't. BTW: you have very little chance to be able to get married without a property under your n…

How much is race or religion factor as well? I'd read somewhere that it is nearly impossible to immigrate to East Asian country if at least one of your parent wasn't native born of that country. The laws around citizenship simply doesn't allow that. In some East Asian countries (perhaps Japan?), someone outsider can't get citizenship even if married to citizen of that country. Wouldn't lack of long term future preven…

In the Republic of China/Taiwan you can become a citizen with no parent being born there. You have to give up your foreign citizenship and may be subject to potential military conscription depending on your age and gender.

If you have the marriage visa you can do this after 3 years residence - it's 5 years residence with a work visa

https://taiwanease.com/article/46/Turning_Taiwanese_A_Step-B...

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#313

Post by cloudwizard »

blacktulip wrote: post #173
ar15saveslives wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Primary/secondary education in China is very, very cruel Could you elaborate? Based upon what I see here in Canada, chinese immigrants maniacally push their children to all functions that can be found around. And it's considered good when there're many chinese children in your kid's class.

It would be a book. There are of course extreme workloads from both the schools and the parents. But to me there is something worse - the public shaming culture. I live in the UK now. Something very odd to me at the beginning is that I can never know how good my kids are doing compare to their classmates. The teachers would politely refuse to answer such questions. And the 'parents meeting' is private to one pupil's…

In the US, it is the same. I had no idea how my son was doing other than his teacher was lying to me. At the beginning of the year, it is impossible to do better than the middle. Not sure if the reasoning was so the children can show improvement? I knew he was doing better than the middle but how well he was doing was a mystery.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#314

Post by lacampbell »

flyinghamster wrote: post #235
loudmax wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe "hard" isn't exactly the right word, but it's certainly different. The sounds aren't hard to make, but using the wrong tone is like using the wrong vowel. You _have_ to speak each syllable with the correct tone or people won't understand you. This can be frustrating when you're learning the language because the difference is very subtle if you haven't grown up speaking a tonal language. If you say something tha…

One thing that I've always wondered about tonal languages is whether they would be easier for musicians to learn (especially if they have perfect pitch) than for non-musicians.

There's a difference between register tones and contour tones. Chinese Languages (such as Mandarin) are contour toned languages - nothing at all like musical notes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tone_(linguistics)#Register_to...

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#315

Post by duaneb »

wmil wrote: post #272
duaneb wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was referring to Obama Sr, who was born in Kenya.

He was never an immigrant. He just came on a student visa, studied, then went back to Kenya.

My mistake, I didn't realize that meaning of immigrant. Nonetheless, I think my point stands, perhaps even stronger.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#316

Post by parennoob »

finid wrote: post #309
parennoob wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am an Indian in the US. I get the general idea of what you are saying, but I should note that it has a strong implicit assumption of a very liberal community. In such communities (say in SF or NYC), I am welcomed pretty warmly. On the other hand, in a bunch of mostly male, middle-aged, Christian tech people in Middle America, I am regarded with a mildly welcoming/neutral attitude at best and open hostility that is…

That "mildly welcoming/neutral attitude at best and open hostility that is leaning-towards-but-not-exactly-racism" attitude proves my point. That's much better than what folks from Black Africa, many with a much lighter skin tone than you, experience.

Yes, but the initial thing you said was:

> It's almost as if we welcome you with open arms.

Perhaps there is something being lost in cross-cultural language or sarcasm, but I don't think "We might be racist to you, but we're way worse racist to this other group, so you have it good, really" should be expressed as "..as if we welcome you with open arms" and "You have an advantage...". Both of those are traditionally very positive expressions and you are applying them to fairly negative actual events.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#317

Post by closeparen »

edblarney wrote: post #297
_audakel wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> cruel def: willfully causing pain or suffering to others, feeling no concern about it. Shaming is undesirable, but I wouldn't say publicly knowing how you rank compared to others would constitute "cruel". Its really how the world works - in sports you see exact stats of how your do, publicly traded companies/CEOs are meticulously analysed publicly on how they perform etc. etc. There does need to be a balance btwn h…

"but I wouldn't say publicly knowing how you rank compared to others would constitute "cruel". Its really how the world works " This is not true. A) It's ludicrous to wrap 'personhood' and 'identity' out of how well someone is able to study and write arbitrary tests. Completely wrong. What if some kid learns better visually, than orally? And he's actually much smarter? What about the kids that are smart, but poor at…

I agree with the thrust of what you're saying, but tech jobs are absolutely allocated on the basis of an extremely contrived test (the whiteboard interview).

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#318

Post by jameshart »

cylinder wrote: post #130
duaneb wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean how the child of an immigrant is President?

His father was not an immigrant, he was born in Queens. And the immigration laws are a much bigger obstacle now than they were even in the 80s.

Weird correction.

Mary Anne MacLeod Trump, mother to Donald, was born on the Isle of Lewis in Scotland in 1912, emigrated to the US in 1930, married an American in 1936, naturalized 1942.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#319

Post by gaoshan »

eva1984 wrote: post #311
sytelus wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much is race or religion factor as well? I'd read somewhere that it is nearly impossible to immigrate to East Asian country if at least one of your parent wasn't native born of that country. The laws around citizenship simply doesn't allow that. In some East Asian countries (perhaps Japan?), someone outsider can't get citizenship even if married to citizen of that country. Wouldn't lack of long term future preven…

True. China, or PRC, has issued fewer than 2000 green cards to foreigners every since its foundation, and most of them are issued to people who have Chinese ancestry. Race. Chinese people are pretty...racist to TBH. But if you are White, it is probably going to benefit you. Good luck if you are people of colors. People hate PC here, but you will hate China for zero PC as well. A part that I really don't like about Ch…

>But you are openly advocating about that, people will frown upon you, and will keep you distance.

Having lived in an oppressively religious area (in the American South) this is one of the things I like best about China. It's a relief, compared to how it is in super religious areas.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#320

Post by eva1984 »

gaoshan wrote: post #319
eva1984 wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True. China, or PRC, has issued fewer than 2000 green cards to foreigners every since its foundation, and most of them are issued to people who have Chinese ancestry. Race. Chinese people are pretty...racist to TBH. But if you are White, it is probably going to benefit you. Good luck if you are people of colors. People hate PC here, but you will hate China for zero PC as well. A part that I really don't like about Ch…

>But you are openly advocating about that, people will frown upon you, and will keep you distance. Having lived in an oppressively religious area (in the American South) this is one of the things I like best about China. It's a relief, compared to how it is in super religious areas.

Agree, for me this is not a bad thing either, just a fact.

Religion is not a taboo in China, as is not welcome.

Post reply on HN