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China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

bloomberg.com

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Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#211

Post by dang »

clifanatic wrote: post #162

> There is no union nor labour law in China (well technically they both exist but..). Same thing in America. > So labour abusing is normal. Same thing in America. > Many tech workers are 'voluntarily' working 996 on a 955 pay slip. Same thing in America.

Please don't argue like this here. It has troll effects whether that is your intent or not. Instead, please argue substantively, and get less inflammatory (not more) as a topic becomes more divisive.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13168197 and marked it off-topic.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#213

Post by xiaoma »

serge2k wrote: post #196
snambi wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm an indian immigrant, this is totally not true. There may be edge cases, but in general, cannot agree with this statement.

what? The american immigration system is pretty awful. H-1B to employer sponsored green card is a really lousy system.

Try immigrating to China.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#214

Post by icantdrive55 »

rfdub wrote: post #201
laurent123456 wrote: post #22

The article doesn't mention that but another possible factor is that life is not that great over there either. If you are not Chinese, you'll always be a foreigner there, even if you spend ten years in the same city, so that makes it difficult to integrate. You'll also have to deal with the Chinese administration for the visa, residence permit, etc. which is quite a pain. It's definitely a great place to visit or eve…

Racial discrimination is completely legal in China. Why the hell would anyone want to move to a country where they can legally be discriminated against?

While we let any foreigner buy property in the USA with a phone call.

Excuse me, they have some new regulation that purports to vet illegal foreign money?

Out of everything our country overlooks, letting foreigners buy up our real-estate really bothers me.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#216

Post by fil_a_del_fee_a »

justicezyx wrote: post #154
yzard wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Chinese, Chinese culture think taking the education is the best way to be success. Honestly, most think that's the only way to do it, no matter they are poor/rich, or even under educated. if they(including me) want their kids to live better in the future, the fundamental thing is education. I attended a very competitive high school in China, and under pretty high peer pressure, books were stacking up on my desk.…

> books were stacking up on my desk That's a common situation in Chinese high school. I'd say most Chinese high school are equally competitive. I am in a not so high-ranked school in Shanxi. And I literally have less than 1 day of rest each week. Each day it's from 6am to 9pm. Early self-study, day lecture, and night self-study, all in classroom...

Serious question from a concerned American..

How much are you learning and more importantly, are you retaining this information? What subjects / topics are you studying?

The reason that I ask, is that I work in IT. If you spent this amount of time devoted to learning a programming language, web design, etc... you would be in an excellent position to work remotely for a company like mine. If you spend 6-9 learning everything under the sun, I think it is kind of a waste.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#217

Post by arrosenberg »

st3v3r wrote: post #189
evidencepi wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

language != culture

No, but communication plays a huge deal in being able to absorb the culture, as well as share your own.

Very true. Most places in the US are fairly welcoming if you can speak English and communicate. It's even common for xenophobes to cut out an exception for immigrants and minorities they know personally and feel friendly toward.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#218

Post by _audakel »

blacktulip wrote: post #173
ar15saveslives wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Primary/secondary education in China is very, very cruel Could you elaborate? Based upon what I see here in Canada, chinese immigrants maniacally push their children to all functions that can be found around. And it's considered good when there're many chinese children in your kid's class.

It would be a book. There are of course extreme workloads from both the schools and the parents. But to me there is something worse - the public shaming culture. I live in the UK now. Something very odd to me at the beginning is that I can never know how good my kids are doing compare to their classmates. The teachers would politely refuse to answer such questions. And the 'parents meeting' is private to one pupil's…

> cruel

def: willfully causing pain or suffering to others, feeling no concern about it.

Shaming is undesirable, but I wouldn't say publicly knowing how you rank compared to others would constitute "cruel". Its really how the world works - in sports you see exact stats of how your do, publicly traded companies/CEOs are meticulously analysed publicly on how they perform etc. etc.

There does need to be a balance btwn hypercompetiton, and "everyone gets a trophy" mentality. I feel like the US has swung far to one side and china the other. Best would be some where in the middle. Maybe have a live list of the top 10-15% of student scores.

I am a parent, and don't want to hurt my daughter, but at the same time a little pain and suffering makes you stronger.

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#219

Post by suanmeiguo »

blacktulip wrote: post #68

As a Chinese I would say that the points in this article, though true, are not among the driving reasons. If you ask me, I would present this list: 1. Practically, there are only 4-5 cities suitable for 'tech talents' in China. The properties prices in these cities are comparable to the ones in NY and SF while the salary isn't. BTW: you have very little chance to be able to get married without a property under your n…

I'm a Chinese and I moved to US 5 years ago. Some of these are not true at least when I left China (I still go back every year and don't feel these at all).

>BTW: you have very little chance to be able to get married without a property under your name in China.

This is exaggerated. I've only seen such thing on news or from rumors. But in real life, a lot of my friends, classmates and colleges (both male and female) got married without owning a property.

>Primary/secondary education in China is very, very cruel

How can education be cruel? You may say it's hard or ineffective, but cruel?? What happened to you in your child life?

Re: China won't be luring foreign tech talent any time soon

#220

Post by 1_2__3 »

Hasknewbie wrote: post #98

The article is avoiding the elephant in the room: the lack of openness and information access is merely a consequence of having an illegitimate regime where everything is ruled by coercion, corruption, and political connections. While you're there, if some company dumps chemicals in your backyard, somebody with a badge hounds you, or your employer refuses to pay you, good luck getting your day in court. They'd be doi…

I'd say that's one of two elephants in the room, the other being rampant racism.
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