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The DEA is withdrawing a proposal to ban another plant citing public outcry

washingtonpost.com

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Re: The DEA is withdrawing a proposal to ban another plant citing public outcry

#121

Post by oxide »

hiisukun wrote: post #90
oxide wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really isn't a course reversal, the people holding the purse strings seemed to have forced the DEA's hand into extending the period of public comment. IIRC something similar happened with MDMA. Hopefully folks like myself who have used Kratom to alleviate opiate withdrawal to great success will come forward and comment. Anecdotally speaking, there are folks who have used kratom to ween themselves off of maintenanc…

For those that may have read this comment and found it strangely familiar, I'll save you the trouble googling. It appears oxide regularly comments on opiate related threads, so his above anecdote isn't a copy of someone else's comment - it is just him re-stating his experiences he has posted before. I mean no criticism of your story oxide; merely commenting for those who thought something might be awry.

I suppose I did start parroting what I said last time I commented here on kratom thread, yeesh.

I ought to have qualified it with a disclaimer if I was just going to repeat myself. I feel it's decent basic information on kratom for the uninitiated, but I didn't mean to parrot myself like that. It's been a long week.

My apologies, and thank you for clarifying.

Re: The DEA is withdrawing a proposal to ban another plant citing public outcry

#122

Post by [deleted] »

hiisukun wrote: post #90
oxide wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really isn't a course reversal, the people holding the purse strings seemed to have forced the DEA's hand into extending the period of public comment. IIRC something similar happened with MDMA. Hopefully folks like myself who have used Kratom to alleviate opiate withdrawal to great success will come forward and comment. Anecdotally speaking, there are folks who have used kratom to ween themselves off of maintenanc…

For those that may have read this comment and found it strangely familiar, I'll save you the trouble googling. It appears oxide regularly comments on opiate related threads, so his above anecdote isn't a copy of someone else's comment - it is just him re-stating his experiences he has posted before. I mean no criticism of your story oxide; merely commenting for those who thought something might be awry.

[deleted]

Re: The DEA is withdrawing a proposal to ban another plant citing public outcry

#123

Post by oxide »

adrusi wrote: post #116
M00n_Sl47r wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd argue that an opiate naive individual on 10g of red vein would be feeling VERY mad nice, considering that dose has me, not opiate naive, feeling mad nice. Definitely at the very least as strong a feeling as codeine

I haven't taken that high of a dose, nor have I taken red vein, but the guidelines I've read suggest that at 10g you're likely to experience uncomfortable levels of nausea if you don't have tolerance.

I agree, you'll likely puke if you are opiate-naive and try to "toss-n-wash" (swallow a spoonful of leaf with a thick juice) 1/3rd of an ounce of powdered kratom leaf.

someone like that should start with just a few grams, approximately a teaspoonful. it's also normal to not feel anything at all the first few times you take it.

for someone opiate dependent, that dose is enough to halt the physical symptoms of withdrawal and alleviate some of the emotional symptoms, albeit for a short time. if you want to quit opiate abuse badly enough, that's just about all you need.

Re: The DEA is withdrawing a proposal to ban another plant citing public outcry

#124

Post by Stanleymilgram »

M00n_Sl47r wrote: post #54
WhitneyLand wrote: post #14

I don't agree with the ban, but it seems like the risks of kratom are not discussed, and in fact even downplayed by saying hey, it's just a plant. To help me be an informed reader I would like WaPo to mention: 1) If you search kratom withdrawal there are a ton of anecdotal reports that sound pretty unpleasant if not debilitating. 2) What is the frequency of severe side effects, as best as can be known? 3) That "natur…

Long term kratom use can cause a dependence, and the withdrawals are very very similar to heroin/morphine withdrawals. regarding your second point, I cant find any hard sources, but my experience has been that unless one is doing WAAYY too much kratom, both per dose and over longer periods of time. Unless you are already an opioid addict trying to use kratom to maintain and kick a harder habit (the well known use is…

This is ridiculous! First, please become informed before posting on a subject you clearly know little about. Second, in your "aforementioned" comment, you did not differentiate between uei and plain leaf kratom. This means you are either a "plant", or just a complete m. I know first-hand that coming off daily use of plain leaf kratom is a cakewalk compared to pharmaceuticals like methadone. Kratom is very similar to stopping your daily cup of coffee. You do not have 2 weeks of severe withdrawal nor do you have years in a state of PAWS. Also, if you think man made drugs like methadone are safer than natural substances like kratom, you need to head back to your big pharma office. Kratom is safe when taken in moderation. It will not kill you DEAD because when you take too much, it induces the users to vomit. It does not cause a complete shutdown of your cns! And when used daily for anxiety or other ailments, it is much safer than big pharmas "non natural" poisons. All big pharma concoctions can kill you and "accidental" overdoses occur every minute in the US on a daily basis. You are wrong and I question the sincerity of your comment.

Re: The DEA is withdrawing a proposal to ban another plant citing public outcry

#125

Post by dismantlethesun »

Fargren wrote: post #81
nikcub wrote: post #68

> Schedule I substances are those that have the following findings: > 1. The drug or other substance has a high potential for abuse. > 2. The drug or other substance has no currently accepted medical use in treatment in the United States. > 3. There is a lack of accepted safety for use of the drug or other substance under medical supervision Kratom doesn't meet any of those requirements, let alone all three. The sche…

>>over 3x as many Americans who were killed in Iraq in total - so 3 Iraq wars per year. I know what you mean, but it really bothers me that you are only counting American deaths. The total number of Iraqi deaths arising from the Iraq war is highly disputed, but it seems to be somewhere between 150,000 and a bit over 1,000,000, depending on the survey and whether it only counts direct deaths of combatants vs. surveys…

I think he's just comparing deaths of Americans by action A to deaths of Americans by action B.

There's no ulterior motive there; just a desire to compare apples to apples.

Re: The DEA is withdrawing a proposal to ban another plant citing public outcry

#126

Post by spaces_____ »

M00n_Sl47r wrote: post #110
spaces_____ wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I only have about 4 years off and on experience with powdered leaf but would never touch the extracts. It is similar to the difference between having a single beer and drinking vodka straight from the bottle. Kratom has helped me a lot with sticking to an exercise routine and sleep. I try to never exceed 8 grams of powdered leaf a day. When I hit that, I taper off and take a break for 1-2 months.

how does your tapering schedule work? If you don't mind me asking.

When I take kratom I dose 2x a day. Drop by .25 or .50 grams for each dose. When each dose is 2 grams, I switch to dosing 3 grams 1x a day. Right before bed. Then I just taper that down at the same rate.

When I get to 0.5 grams per day, I just stop. I may sleep a little less and feel a little irritable for a few days but then it's back to normal. Working out every day and abstaining from sugary foods eliminates any remaining withdrawal symptoms in my experience.

Re: The DEA is withdrawing a proposal to ban another plant citing public outcry

#127

Post by GordonS »

rms wrote: post #104
GordonS wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On mobile now, so can't give examples, but do a search on Google scholar and you really will find plenty evidence there

Really? I tried doing this search and can't find much. I'm pretty up on the state of the scientific literature on kratom, because I'm in the industry, curious, and have been actively working at improving the dreadful wikipedia article. There's this case, http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924933811... , but it's a case of one. There are some cases of simultaneous kratom and alcohol dependence, but tha…

Sorry, I thought I was replying to a thread about kratom's efficacy on pain, not alcohol dependence. Not sure if I hit reply on the wrong thread or just misread it!
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