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Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

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Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#171

Post by adventured »

rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #74

Symptom of a bigger problem: nobody in the criminal justice system is punished for making the wrong move. There is no law enforcement downside to civil asset forfeiture. Officer-involved shootings are discouraged from prosecution or otherwise involve highly-paid "expert" witnesses saying the officer had no other choice - at taxpayer expense. Prosecutors are valued by the number of wins, not by how many innocent peopl…

> Symptom of a bigger problem: nobody in the criminal justice system is punished for making the wrong move

Step 1) End all police unions. There desperately needs to be a federal law prohibiting the formation of any police union anywhere in the United States. (we'll add this to the list of things that will never happen)

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#172

Post by lettergram »

brbsix wrote: post #96
brador wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can an inanimate object be charged with a crime? It's inanimate, so by definition cannot make a decision... Also, if they're confiscating assets, why not confiscate the car? Why just the cash/cards? How do we get this absurd law overturned? What's the minimum required? Supreme court decision?

They've long confiscated cars and cash. They're just upping their game.

Yeah... Now, the logic is:

"You have a bunch of money on your ATM card. You can potentially go to an ATM take out cash, then get drugs. Now, I need to seize all your money to ensure you can't buy those illegal drugs that may or may not exist."

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#173

Post by adventured »

tremon wrote: post #137
Shivetya wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

when you are pulled over you turn the phone OFF. Its simple and its fast.

On the other hand, when I'm pulled over, I definitely want my phone to be recording audio.

Or consider using a dash cam with audio recording.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#174

Post by cglace »

davb wrote: post #142
cglace wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Oh, so if I have a card in someone else's name, you'll charge it, thus causing someone who doesn't even know about it to lose? From what I understand the technology is for seizing money from prepaid cards. For other cards it just looks up information about the account. Thats how it helps with identity theft.

From the article: > Now, the Oklahoma Highway Patrol has a device that also allows them to seize money in your bank account or on prepaid cards.

The article is wrong.

ERAD card scanners were first developed around 2012 for the science and technology arm of the U.S. Department of Homeland Security to combat the use of prepaid debit cards by drug cartels to transport drug money, according to a Homeland Security media release.

Since then, some law enforcement agencies around the country have adopted the technology.

According to ERAD Group’s patent for the device, law enforcement can determine the balance of money in an account associated with a prepaid card that is part of branded “open loop” networks such as Visa or MasterCard or “closed loop” cards that only allow purchases at a single company, such as gift cards.

When the card is scanned by the officer to check the account balance, the system disguises the balance request as a typical vendor request to prevent alerting suspects that law enforcement is checking the card, the patent states.

Once the card’s account balance is determined, the officer can use the device to freeze the funds, preventing withdrawal or use of the money in the account, or seize the funds by having them transferred to a law enforcement financial account, the patent states.

Although the device does not allow funds from non-prepaid cards to be frozen or seized, it can provide the officer information about those cards such as the card number, the name on the card, expiration date and the card issuer.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#176

Post by eonw »

dang wrote: post #165
eonw wrote: post #104

From Article: "If you can prove that you have a legitimate reason to have that money it will be given back to you. And we've done that in the past," Vincent said about any money seized. Under no circumstance should i have to PROVE where my money came from nor how i got it. this is assumed guilt and utterly unamerican IMO. Where is the burden of proof that must be reached before taking my assets and forcing me to prov…

> backwoods state full of backwoods laws, and apparently backwoods people Attacking an entire population of people like that is a nasty breach of HN's civility rule. Please don't ever post anything like this again. It's the upvoters of such comments who should most be ashamed of themselves. The fact that people here feel angry about police seizing cash without due process can, and must, be kept distinct from cheap sl…

i did not attack them, i said "apparently" meaning it would seem that they are based on the things they allow and agree to. if you allow backwoods laws to be passed and enforced... well you know, if the shoe fits.

furthermore being called backwoods is only an attack if you choose it to be, some people don't mind being unsophisticated.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#177

Post by cmdrfred »

tremon wrote: post #156
jandrese wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes you think money can't be put on trial? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._$124,700_in_U...

Oh I'm aware of that. I was pointing out the logical inconsistency between "not a person, so no 4th amendment" and "not a person, so no case"

There is no logic here. The 4th amendment clearly states papers are protected, cash is paper. It's protected no matter what retarded logic you use.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#179

Post by tantalor »

rlpb wrote: post #29
maxaf wrote: post #14

This can't possibly be legal or even technically feasible. The victim can call her bank and report a fraudulent transaction, which pits the bank against a warrantless seizure that's impossible to defend in court. Surely banks can catch on and frontload an "identity protection" mechanism that'll simply block transactions from anything matching "ERAD" or however they identify themselves to the ACH. It's doubtful that l…

> which pits the bank against a warrantless seizure that's impossible to defend in court Your argument could equally be applied against regular (cash) civil asset forfeiture. The outcome is the same either way. "Sorry, it was authorised by the authorities, nothing we can do". You'll be short of the money until you sue, same as in regular civil asset forfeiture. When you do sue, you'll have to prove that you're entitl…

> it was authorised by the authorities

It was not authorized by the card holder or a court order, so it is fraud.

Re: Police use new device to seize money in bank accounts or on prepaid cards

#180

Post by jsprogrammer »

DickingAround wrote: post #2

And the scanner maker gets a 7% cut. What could go wrong: "the state is paying ERAD Group Inc., $5,000 for the software and scanners, then 7.7 percent of all the cash the highway patrol seizes"

Highwaymen don't go away, they just get new uniforms and tools.

Particularly egregious is Lt. Vincent's take:

>"If you can prove can[sic] prove[sic] that you have a legitimate reason to have that money it will be given back to you. And we've done that in the past," Vincent said about any money seized.

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