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Why we won’t be supporting Sign in with Apple

blog.anylist.com

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Re: Why we won’t be supporting Sign in with Apple

#91

Post by Larrikin »

jzzskijj wrote: post #40
muro wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never seen an app that required a FB or Google login. It was always possible to use email+password.

Pokemon Go's account own doesn't work. Even if you manage to create that account, it won't log you in. With Google account it works as expected. I tried to create two Pokemon Go accounts, gave up and created a Pokemon Go only Google account for child's playing. It has worked a few years.

When did you have this issue? My account is tied to my Google account because on launch the Go servers were completely inundated and the account creation was just constantly failing but using a Google account allowed you to skip that step and start playing.

This was the first month of Pokemon Go years ago. I haven't heard of it being an issue lately but I also haven't needed to create an account in a very long time.

Re: Why we won’t be supporting Sign in with Apple

#92

Post by forrestthewoods »

> Furthermore, if there are platforms where AnyList doesn’t support Sign in with Apple, like Android, and someone wants to log into their account, they’d have to know their privaterelay.appleid.com email address. (And that certainly won’t be easy to find if you no longer have an iOS device.) And then they’d have to create a password with us, since they wouldn’t be able to sign in using Sign in with Apple.

I’m an avid iOS user with a Windows desktop. I will never use “Sign-In with Apple” for this reason. It’s not useable unless you exclusively use Apple devices. Which I don’t.

Re: Why we won’t be supporting Sign in with Apple

#93

Post by kinkrtyavimoodh »

crispyporkbites wrote: post #61
duxup wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if Apple would be ok with asking them to give up their email? Apple clearly likes the idea of the hide option... personally I would expect a less than positive reception from Apple. I get where both AnyList (if they asked) and Apple (if they didn't like it) would be coming from here. It does seem to be a shortcoming here where outside of a user one time sign up situation... you don't want to have to burden t…

Why should Apple be allowed to dictate if an app asks for an email address? They should not become the defacto law makers of our society

That ship sailed long ago. Apple basically has apps and app-developers by the balls, not to mention the 30% extortion money they try to get not just for app purchases but any transaction done within the app, so much as even banning an app from telling the user that they can do the transaction elsewhere.

It makes my blood boil but from the discussions I see on HN about it, most people here seem to be more or less ok with it.

Re: Why we won’t be supporting Sign in with Apple

#94

Post by stickfigure »

lolsal wrote: post #87
stickfigure wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For my last two companies (both B2B), I implemented login via Google accounts only. Google login has a number of advantages: 1) Identity is an email address. If I wanted to rip out Google, or Google kicked me off the platform, all I need to do is add passwords and put a "forgot my password" link and my customers continue business as usual. 2) It's not a google-specific email address. You can create Google accounts fo…

Can you educate me on what you mean by Google accounts only? I thought Google auth was just OAuth.

I use the Google sign in javascript:

https://developers.google.com/identity/sign-in/web

There may be other options if you want to mess with oauth yourself, but this one is pretty near zero effort.

Re: Why we won’t be supporting Sign in with Apple

#95

Post by WorldMaker »

addicted wrote: post #70
ssalka wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> making them pick a different e-mail I think it's more about _letting_ them pick a different email. While I can understand that AnyList (or any other app for that matter) would want to, on occasion, send marketing emails to users, I don't think any app would, in their right mind, _require_ the user to provide a 2nd email address. But by allowing them to optionally give that 2nd address, they can provide a path forwa…

So someone explicitly chose to hide their email, and then on logging into an app is asked to share their real email. Anyone in that position would think the app is shady AF and user hostile.

Progressive consent makes sense though: in starting out with an app that i have no previous trust relationship, "Hide my email" sounds like a good idea in a trial balloon. If after using the application it tells me that to better use its collaboration tools it would like me to consent in giving a more direct email address, I might change my mind given changes in trust relationship (I have been using this app for some time and I trust it more now) and/or greater context for why the app is interested in a more direct email address ("make collaboration easier").

It's not necessarily shady or user hostile when done right, and there are plenty of opportunity to add trust relationship building as a part of the consent process (links to privacy policies; details about marketing policies; etc).

It's also not that different from how many iOS applications (at least) are encouraged (in App Store best practices) to handle consent models for location tracking and notifications: ask the user as they become familiar with the application, not up front, and provide as much context as you can.

Re: Why we won’t be supporting Sign in with Apple

#96

Post by scarface74 »

JohnTHaller wrote: post #20
disgruntledphd2 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is a pretty anti-competitive move on Apple's part. They're essentially using their control of the iOS ecosystem to benefit unrelated products. I seem to remember that those kinds of actions didn't work out well for Microsoft :)

Apple takes many anti-competitive and consumer-hostile actions. They can freely get away with it, though, as they aren't a monopoly.

How is this user hostile - forcing app developers to give users a choice that doesn’t give the app developer your real email?

Re: Why we won’t be supporting Sign in with Apple

#97

Post by nikisweeting »

mh- wrote: post #59
nikisweeting wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://tailscale.com/ requires it, as do many other apps that explicitly "don't want to become identity providers and would rather offload that burden to someone else".

Tailscale supports other SSO providers, too. https://tailscale.com/kb/1013/sso-providers

Yup, FWIW I think their selection is great, I was just using them as an example of a company that chose not to provide any in-house email+password option.

Re: Why we won’t be supporting Sign in with Apple

#98

Post by scarface74 »

stickfigure wrote: post #8

If you implement Sign In With Apple, you don't have a relationship with your customers anymore. They're Apple's customers, and Apple can take them away at any time.

I don’t want to have a relationship with every app developer. If you want a relationship with your customers that you control, you are free not to implement any third party sign on and implement your own.

Re: Why we won’t be supporting Sign in with Apple

#100

Post by scarface74 »

tboyd47 wrote: post #2

There's a subtle sense of exuberance shining through in this article that makes it a gratifying read, even if you've never heard of the company before. Kudos to them for their decision not to bow to Apple's demands. Please tell us how it goes!

That works as intended - they took out FB integration.
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