How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct • Hacker News Board

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#81

Post by rayiner » Sun, May 31, 2020, 2:47 PM UTC

StellarTabi wrote: post #11

It's always ethical to film police misconduct, in fact what's unethical is that they're not already filming themselves. Safety is important, protesters (and even journalists...) have been livestreaming themselves innocently doing nothing (in contrast to other media's hyper-focusing on "looting") then getting shot with rubber bullets. One of them reportedly has permanent blindness in the left eye as a result. Police b…

> It's always ethical to film police misconduct, in fact what's unethical is that they're not already filming themselves

The issue is filming what else might be going on around, which may be sensitive.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#82

Post by ramadan_steve » Sun, May 31, 2020, 2:47 PM UTC

Minor49er wrote: post #76

dessant wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't even need to leave your porch to get shot. Police and National Guard are patrolling neighborhoods and shooting civilians with paint canisters on their own property in Minneapolis. In one case they yelled "Light 'em up!" before starting to shoot [1] with ammunition that could blind people. It's legal to be outside your house during the curfew in Minneapolis [2]. > Can I be outside my house (on my property) a…

There's a clear curfew order to stay inside. The police come by and see five young adults sitting on a porch. The police order them inside. The group responds by sitting there and continuing to film. So the police fire a single non-lethal shot to get them to go inside. I dont have any sympathy for this group or their pair of greened jeans that they lost in this altercation.

Go fuck your self

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#83

Post by Broken_Hippo » Sun, May 31, 2020, 2:49 PM UTC

vixen99 wrote: post #55

eganist wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has underfunded education and training at every fundamental step of life. It's the root of many of our problems.

That does not seem to be the case. The US spends more on education than any other country. $16,268 a year per student vs global average of $10,759". It's evident that money does not translate into better results. "According to the Washington thinktank the National Center on Education and the Economy (NCEE), the average student in Singapore is 3.5 years ahead of her US counterpart in maths, 1.5 years ahead in reading…

The problem with these sorts of averages is that it doesn't paint an accurate picture. There are schools with buildings in disrepair and schools without the same resources as other schools. And some have waaay more resources and spending per student than most schools. This is, in part, because a lot of states don't fund their schools by redistributing money across all schools. Instead, they rely on the school district's tax base - which means if you are in a poor neighborhood, you probably won't have as much funding. The same goes for being in an area that doesn't utilize the public schools as much as other areas (using private schools) - this decreases federal funding that is reliant on the number of children going to your school.

All this means that it isn't really evident that money doesn't translate into better results. It isn't strictly funding, that is true - poverty seriously affects how well students can perform, for example - but it should be quite obvious that a school that cannot afford maintenance, proper computers for students to learn on, or enough staff so that classes are a manageable size can't really teach as well as a moderately funded school.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#84

Post by rayiner » Sun, May 31, 2020, 2:50 PM UTC

samdamsamm wrote: post #13

StellarTabi wrote: post #11

It's always ethical to film police misconduct, in fact what's unethical is that they're not already filming themselves. Safety is important, protesters (and even journalists...) have been livestreaming themselves innocently doing nothing (in contrast to other media's hyper-focusing on "looting") then getting shot with rubber bullets. One of them reportedly has permanent blindness in the left eye as a result. Police b…

Tonight I witnessed a young girl get knocked out cold by a tear gas canister shot into her face from about a 40 ft. range. She was holding her hands up. There was nothing but peaceful protesters standing around, not blocking traffic. No vandalism anywhere in sight. This was in Louisville, KY. The police fired rubber bullets at the group of people carrying her away to a place on the other side of the line of humvees b…

> Everything most middle-income Americans think about our police forces is wrong

After moving to the suburbs, I realized that most Americans base their opinions on their own police forces. The last time I got pulled over in the exurbs where I live, the officer basically apologized for pulling me over. Things are very different an hour away from here in DC.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#85

Post by gruez » Sun, May 31, 2020, 2:51 PM UTC

tonyarkles wrote: post #35

kenneth wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was wondering the same thing myself today. It'd be interesting to come up with a drone that's ideal for this purpose… that can quickly fly and relocate somewhere, but can land on any flat surface and record remotely. You could perch it on nearby buildings or even things like traffic lights

As a warning for people who might try to do this with existing off-the-shelf drones, be warned that trying to do this is likely going to result in you losing your drone. Not that you'll have a crash, but my experience with a wide range of drones (from little $30 whoops to $40k commercial cinematography units) is that they often do not like to takeoff again after landing and sitting for any length of time. Best I can…

That doesn't make any sense. How is the drone supposed to take off during normal operation?

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#86

Post by Broken_Hippo » Sun, May 31, 2020, 2:51 PM UTC

rayiner wrote: post #81

StellarTabi wrote: post #11

It's always ethical to film police misconduct, in fact what's unethical is that they're not already filming themselves. Safety is important, protesters (and even journalists...) have been livestreaming themselves innocently doing nothing (in contrast to other media's hyper-focusing on "looting") then getting shot with rubber bullets. One of them reportedly has permanent blindness in the left eye as a result. Police b…

> It's always ethical to film police misconduct, in fact what's unethical is that they're not already filming themselves The issue is filming what else might be going on around, which may be sensitive.

In general, if you are able to film police misconduct, you are in the public sphere. If the stuff going an around them is sensitive, the ethical thing to do isn't to abstain from filming, but to be careful who you share the video with.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#87

Post by dkdk8283 » Sun, May 31, 2020, 2:52 PM UTC

jagged-chisel wrote: post #25

dessant wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't even need to leave your porch to get shot. Police and National Guard are patrolling neighborhoods and shooting civilians with paint canisters on their own property in Minneapolis. In one case they yelled "Light 'em up!" before starting to shoot [1] with ammunition that could blind people. It's legal to be outside your house during the curfew in Minneapolis [2]. > Can I be outside my house (on my property) a…

> shooting civilians with paint canisters on their own property Even if it weren't legal to be outside on your own property from 8p-6a, this isn't proper enforcement of the law.

> Even if it weren't legal to be outside on your own property from 8p-6a

It should always be legal to be outside on your own property. Anything less is unacceptable.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#88

Post by bearcobra » Sun, May 31, 2020, 2:53 PM UTC

Minor49er wrote: post #76

dessant wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't even need to leave your porch to get shot. Police and National Guard are patrolling neighborhoods and shooting civilians with paint canisters on their own property in Minneapolis. In one case they yelled "Light 'em up!" before starting to shoot [1] with ammunition that could blind people. It's legal to be outside your house during the curfew in Minneapolis [2]. > Can I be outside my house (on my property) a…

There's a clear curfew order to stay inside. The police come by and see five young adults sitting on a porch. The police order them inside. The group responds by sitting there and continuing to film. So the police fire a single non-lethal shot to get them to go inside. I dont have any sympathy for this group or their pair of greened jeans that they lost in this altercation.

> There's a clear curfew order to stay inside

The curfew order clearly says that people do NOT need to stay inside. https://dps.mn.gov/macc/Pages/faq.aspx

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#89

Post by Broken_Hippo » Sun, May 31, 2020, 2:55 PM UTC

xapata wrote: post #3

tmsh wrote: post #2

Can I just say - the sources for good, actionable news are sometimes the strangest of places these days. I've started just reading: http://reddit.com/r/news instead of newspaper websites and it's nice - some affiliate tv news stations (the Minneapolis newspapers...not so much) or student newspapers (I see you Crimson reporting on the anthropology department) are getting it done and sometimes more consistently than ma…

Teen Vogue has been surprisingly adult in a time when adults ... aren't.

It has been quite refreshing. I find it unfortunate that the adult version hasn't followed suit.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#90

Post by bzbarsky » Sun, May 31, 2020, 2:56 PM UTC

curryst wrote: post #79

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only unethical lawyers? Suppressing evidence can get them disbarred.

Ianal, but I wouldn't think the defense attorney would be required to share that? Wouldn't it violate your clients right to not self-incriminate? The prosecution is definitely not allowed to suppress evidence that would demonstrate someone's innocence, but I don't think the same is true of the defense.

Also not a lawyer, but as I understand it, both the defense and the prosecution tell each other and the judge what evidence they plan to bring; unlike crime shows, you generally don't spring surprises in court. In this case the defense would say "we have a video that shows we are innocent" and the prosecution would then request a copy of the video, and a warrant to acquire it.

Providing said video doesn't seem any more self-incrimination than the prosecution asking for a warrant to get written evidence that is in possession of the accused, say, though the line there might start getting blurry if the video is something routinely filmed from the accused's viewpoint. But if it's filmed by a third party, I doubt the self-incrimination provisions would extend to it in any way...