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Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

theguardian.com

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Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#741

Post by cpursley »

pastage wrote: post #736
cpursley wrote: post #711

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about all the misleading news (i.e., positive spin) in the Western world's "free press" that lead to many believing that Ukraine had a chance for a counter offensive (against even basic military thinking and logic). Didn't that lead to unnecessary suffering and deaths during war time (vs say an alternative, beefing up defense lines)? That's just a random recent example. Another older one is the the media going n…

I do not understand how supporting Ukraine can lead to more suffering, there is a long history of implerialism causing suffering so there is a rather large opposition against it in the west. What Russia does to Ukraine is pretty gruesome, it is not even considered a country in russian intellectual discourse that is a bad sign. When we talk about the press and politics these kind of cynical tones are not helpfull. The…

I’m not talking about supporting Ukraine vs not, but about wishful thinking propagated by media that led thousands of unfortunate Ukrainian souls into heavily mined traps. And that’s my point, media spread a narrative that was at odds with expert advice and basic military strategy (there’s mathematical equations about force required, etc for these types of operations that was ignored). That idea should have been able to been challenged without accusations of being in bed with Putin. We all saw the aftermath. Bad ideas, even from the good guys, can be deadly.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#742

Post by dariosalvi78 »

angra_mainyu wrote: post #309
patall wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have examples for Europe blocking Russia? Because all I have seen is DNS providers omitting certain sites (i.e RT), but their apps still work (plus URLs when using other DNS). An nothing of that coming from the nation states as all seems to be due to the activities of private companies doing these things.

rt.com and their twitter are blocked. How are you not aware of this? It's been a few years already. The EU ruled on this. https://paste.pics/4b60ebef97d3b7fbb6aba74637c2e818 https://paste.pics/0cb2ae98754165dad5cf086e75c4cc31

I'm in Sweden and I can see rt.com

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#744

Post by gravescale »

throwup238 wrote: post #416
suddenexample wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The US White House press secretary issued a weak statement condemning Israel's action, but it was on April 1st and the costumed Easter Bunny overshadowed that statement.[7] Wow you can't make this stuff up

Armando Iannucci's career has twice now been upstaged by the increasing ridiculousness of reality in politics. One of the reasons he says he stopped making his first series, The Thick of It, was that UK politicians became parodies of themselves. There was nothing left to make fun of. Then the same thing happened to his American incarnation, Veep.

He's not wrong. This is a real Police and Crimes Commissioner and is not a character from the Thick of It: https://youtube.com/watch?v=xlcWVXHv_As

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#745

Post by bawolff »

loceng wrote: post #429
bawolff wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do these numbers distinguish between journalists killed while doing journalism vs journalists killed as collateral damage not in the capacity of a journalist vs combatants who were journalists prior to picking up a gun and joining the war? I feel like its very hard to draw any conclusions from these numbers without distinguishing between those cases (other than of course that war is a tragedy and innocents generally…

Isn't it any less worse that 170+ journalists were killed among the 30,000+ civilians? And no, it's unlikely these are journalists who picked up a gun - the IDF is dropping up to 2,000 Lbs bombs, and that's possibly how many are killed; however there have been many reports of journalists homes being targeted in direct strikes, at least one journalist I heard who's wife and children/whole family were killed but he was…

> Isn't it any less worse that 170+ journalists were killed among the 30,000+ civilians?

Yes. One is a clear cut war crime, the other is not. (Or at least not in and of itself. There are of course factors that could make those civilian deaths be a war crime, but it depends on the circumstances.)

(To be clear, what i am saying is that intentionally targeting journalists (who have not picked up a gun and joined the fight) is an unambigious war crime. Killing journalists incidentally while targeting something else may or may not be a war crime depending on all sorts of factors)

I consider things that are war crimes to be much worse than things that are not. So i do think there is a big difference between the two scenarios.

I think its also important to recognize that this sort of thing has huge propaganda value for the Palestinian side, so its important to be careful when evaluating circumstantial evidence (and to be clear i would say that about any side in any war when it comes to information that makes their oponent look bad). As the saying goes, truth is the first casualty of war. It can be very difficult to know what is going on in the middle of a conflict.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#746

Post by cpursley »

mrtksn wrote: post #714
cpursley wrote: post #711

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about all the misleading news (i.e., positive spin) in the Western world's "free press" that lead to many believing that Ukraine had a chance for a counter offensive (against even basic military thinking and logic). Didn't that lead to unnecessary suffering and deaths during war time (vs say an alternative, beefing up defense lines)? That's just a random recent example. Another older one is the the media going n…

what a starange statement about the counterattack, as if there was a definite knowledge about the future and the Western propaganda suppressed it. They attempted at taking back their own lands and they failed. The same people claiming to know the future also used to claim that Russia would not attack and later that Ukraine will fall in matter of days. Maybe just stop listening to fortune tellers.

Exactly, I prefer to listen to experts and the experts were saying it was a bad idea (esp without air power). It was news media and politicians (ie, not military experts) that cheered it on.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#747

Post by gravescale »

tenlp wrote: post #721
guappa wrote: post #655

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a bit ironic how we are constantly reminded that china isn't a democracy because they have censorship, while we are free and democratic and don't have censorship (except we do). Italy is passing laws to be able to block websites within 30 minutes, without any oversight from any judge. (more details here, link in italian https://stop-piracy-shield.it/ )

In fact, a series of Western media including the BBC, Reuters, CNN, etc. all have offices in China.... and you can also easily access Western media websites through VPN and other methods which are uncensored

VPNs increasingly don't work well, however, it's not like they completely turn a blind eye. It's some kind of statistical thing that drops connections that "look wierd" that can interfere with even quite obfuscated VPNs.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#748

Post by Ma8ee »

cies wrote: post #682
benja123 wrote: post #646

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Israeli here - I just checked and I can still access the site in both English and Arabic. My guess is you won’t actually see the site being blocked.

After rt.com et al were blocked in the EU they also kept working for a few more week/months before I had to use a mirror/VPN to read the new paper of "the enemy". Side note: I though being able to read the news of the enemy was testimony to the moral high ground of a "modern free and democratic society". No more moral high ground if you are trying to shape the perception of the public with censorship.

Why the scare quotes you put around “the enemy“?

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#749

Post by meijer »

AlecSchueler wrote: post #725
guappa wrote: post #655

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a bit ironic how we are constantly reminded that china isn't a democracy because they have censorship, while we are free and democratic and don't have censorship (except we do). Italy is passing laws to be able to block websites within 30 minutes, without any oversight from any judge. (more details here, link in italian https://stop-piracy-shield.it/ )

In Germany they can't publicly gather to protest Israel's actions either, not legally anyway. https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2023/10/26/complete-censo...

There are regular pro Palestine protests in my German hometown. And they do condemn Israel's actions.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#750

Post by dunekid »

emmelaich wrote: post #538

Hard to care. It's war. Is Haaretz or the Jerusalem Post available in Gaza?

If the Internet is available, then ofcourse these should be available in there. But on the contrary Al Jazeera website itself would be censored out of the Internet for Israel.
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