Apple Unveils the iPad Pro • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#711

Post by acchow » Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 5:05 AM UTC

qyv wrote: post #579

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #559

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The starbucks full of students typing out reports on iPads with bluetooth keyboards begs to differ. I mean, obviousy, you can't do all work on an iPad, but for a certain class of "work" it works fine.

Of course. And don't get me wrong, the iPad is far from worthless and Apple is far from Trivial in the space. The point is that Apple is no longer the leader/innovator in the space. Perhaps I am wrong, but I think that a lot of iOS devices get sold on intangibles rather than concrete benefits or capabilities. Apple has created tremendous value in these intangibles by being so awesome/innovative/ahead for the last 8 y…

"The point is that Apple is no longer the leader/innovator in the space"

But Apple never created new product categories successfully in the past. People bought Macs in lieu of PC's; iPods in lieu of Discmans/minidisc/other MP3 players; iPhones in lieu of flip phones, candy bars, or blackberries.

They tried to create a new product category with the iPad and get people who don't own a computer to buy one (or buy one in addition to their normal computer purchases). It's been mildly successful so far, but sales have been falling. Apple should probably stick with replacing existing product categories with a well-designed, premium alternative.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#712

Post by prapam2 » Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 5:08 AM UTC

mythz wrote: post #603

vezzy-fnord wrote: post #550

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like how "multiple windows" is suddenly considered an advanced feature. You're confusing simplicity with ease of use. Adding a layer of indirection over the intrinsic file system is not simple, and even ease of use is debatable, since it creates an impedance mismatch by definition. Nor is there any reason to consider this a zero-sum game. Having advanced features does not deprive the common user of their comfort, a…

No I'm not confusing simplicity with ease of use, I'm referring to the simplicity from the users perspective (i.e. what matters most) which is the conceptual and cognitive overhead required for them to know to accomplish what they want to do. In the same way a GUI Desktop is simpler and more comfortable to use for most people than DOS or a single Google search box or voice input are simple enough for anyone to use de…

Don't iOS require some additional software to copy over files. When the easiest and simplest way is just drag and drop which is available for Android users.

If you go by sales wouldn't then Android figures indicate that their approach was better?

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#713

Post by prapam2 » Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 5:09 AM UTC

gress wrote: post #667

bad_user wrote: post #601

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know, I've heard this argument on customers not caring about this or that oversimplification or about this or that restriction or about customizations or about poor grandmas and so forth. But you know, numbers don't lie. iOS is not the dominant design. And guess what I have on my Android? A file manager, going hand in hand with uTorrent and VLC. And guess how I'm copying music on my phone? It's not through iTunes…

The numbers of android include huge numbers of unusable devices that exist to displace feature phones. Don't kid yourself about what this means.

How are they unsuable?

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#714

Post by etchalon » Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 5:12 AM UTC

mamon wrote: post #398

camillomiller wrote: post #366

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This comment is exactly why HN won't never understand anything about Apple announcements. Highly technical folks, unable to get out of their technical bias, reprimanding the extremely successful decision makers of a successful company because they pretend to know the matter, while completely ignoring the real world scenarios that actually drive Apple products sales.

It is not a "technical bias", it is more your bias towards Apple. Take the last year's iPhone 6 as an example: HN members complained about small screen sizes for a long time, and it took Steve Job's death to actually make that happen, but gues what? iPhone 6 is most succesfull iPhone ever. Apple did some innovations few years ago (original iPhone, iPad), but since then most of new features in Apple products are taken…

So 3D Touch is something Android has?

This is mostly a tongue-in-cheek comment, but the broader point is that of course Apple has "innovated" since the original iPhone, iPad, iWhatever. In some big ways, and in some small ways. But so have other players in the industry. Apple has borrowed some good ideas from them, just as they have borrowed good ideas from Apple.

However saying Apple hasn't innovated since those original announcements is so hilariously ludicrous.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#715

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 5:15 AM UTC

ams6110 wrote: post #610

rdancer wrote: post #574

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Their ability to churn out better and better devices, year after year, is what's remarkable. That we come to expect it, and don't consider it news, is a testament to their achievement. This is not normal; the industry -- both hardware & software -- is plagued with regressions, with many older models or releases that are preferred by the users to newer ones. Apple are truly unique in their ability to deliver improveme…

Well cars get better every year, so do appliances, so does just about every consumer product if you're not talking about Walmart-type "price is all that matters" stuff. I don't think it's remarkable at all. It would be remarkable if they weren't getting better year after year.

[deleted]

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

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Post by etchalon » Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 5:15 AM UTC

bduerst wrote: post #694

etchalon wrote: post #643

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What are you talking about? Passbook was never a payment system, it just had gift cards. Passbook isn't a payment system NOW. Apple Pay is, Passbook is just the app that shows users their credit cards.

Right, Passbook was Apple's first play at mobile payments. They were trying to build an app ecosystem that used credits to to make mobile payments. It was Apple's response to NFC which wasn't very good.

It wasn't a mobile payments play, though. It was a solution to storing things like movie tickets, airline tickets, gift card vouchers, etc. "Payment" was never in its vocabulary.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#717

Post by etchalon » Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 5:19 AM UTC

lotharbot wrote: post #523

epmatsw wrote: post #341

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"No wifi, less space than a Nomad. Lame."

in 2001, it was. Check out the sales figures [0]. Consumers didn't begin to adopt the iPod in detectable numbers until the third generation (when it got USB syncing), and it didn't really take off until the fourth (full USB connectivity, various other improvements.) [0] http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/01/28/ipod-sales_n_468000...

It look off when they added Windows. Other improvements aside, that was the thing that cracked open the market for them.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#718

Post by e28eta » Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 5:23 AM UTC

realityking wrote: post #527

robotresearcher wrote: post #385

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Nope. The UK and German stores give e.g. iPad Air 2 thickness in mm, weight in grams and screen size in inches. They are sticking to inches deliberately for screen measurement. They even use the German 9,7" instead of the US/UK 9.7" so it's not that they forgot to translate.

Oddly enough, screen sizes are one of the things that are measures in imperial units all over the world. Another example would be engines, where horsepower is incredibly popular.

Maybe because it's really hard to visualize/understand the size of a device based on diagonal screen size? It's only useful to me as a number to compare to other devices. I need height and width, which they do localize.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#719

Post by conception » Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 5:27 AM UTC

bostonpete wrote: post #576

hkmurakami wrote: post #517

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It's limited by global macroeconomics, which is still raising its ceilings.

Well, at some point it's limited by population...

Not really unless we hit zero population growth world-wide. Otherwise, there will always be more people to buy.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

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Post by btgeekboy » Thu, Sep 10, 2015, 5:32 AM UTC

greendestiny wrote: post #672

cezarywojcik wrote: post #628

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I got a Surface Pro 3 almost exclusively for using OneNote on it. It's pretty great for that, but having Windows in the way was sometimes annoying. The Surface is capable of a lot more than I do with it, but I have my MacBook for everything that isn't handwriting. The iPad Pro is exactly what I wanted - a device for writing down notes, sketching designs, and doing so seamlessly without the "bloat" of a full OS in the…

I think this is the angle of attack that Apple is taking here. They want to catch up to the handwriting and sketching abilities of Surface, but they don't want a hybrid OS. In a lot of ways the Surface is a laptop with a detachable keyboard and the OS and eco system is still based on that. Apple wants their eco system to develop from a clean touch OS base into productivity areas. Having said that, they are really lag…

> In a lot of ways the Surface is a laptop with a detachable keyboard

I picked one up on a curious whim, and often use this language to describe the Surface 3. It really does act like a laptop, all the way down to going to sleep while I'm playing music, and hibernating during periods of inactivity.