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Nobody wants to teach anymore

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Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#361

Post by greenie_beans »

diognesofsinope wrote: post #246
germinalphrase wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Why didn't I end up in teaching? The licensing requirements in Minnesota are insane. Counselor's straight up told me I'd have to borrow ~$50k from the UMN for a MS in Curriculum and Instruction before I could teach.” I received my teaching license in Wisconsin and transferred to Minnesota by doing little more than passing the licensure exam. I did not have an MS at that time or when I started teaching in the Minneap…

I don't have a BS in Education (BA in Philosophy), which means you have to go through their M. Ed. program with licensure. You must take Educational Theory/Pedagogy core courses along with required courses in your field -- I had saved money and already taken the calc sequence, linear algebra and differential equations. Grad school at the UMN is ~$10k a semester ( https://onestop.umn.edu/finances/costs/tuition ). Woul…

> The teachers union has been waging a war against future teachers to benefit current teachers for 30 years

this statement is presented as The Truth, do you have some information that backs this up?

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#362

Post by yodsanklai »

Situation is similar in France. Teachers are underpaid and in some fields (e.g. maths), it gets hard to fill open positions. The gvt tries to improve slightly the entry level salary to make the job more attractive, while betting that senior teachers are stuck there with no other job alternatives. And they compensate by hiring under qualified, short term, teachers. To some extent, it's similar in higher education.

The relative freedom enjoyed in academic jobs isn't enough to compensate an increasing salary gap between public/private sectors. In expensive cities, it can even be hard to live decently with a teacher/lecturer salary, and certainly not possible to save for your retirement. If you can't rely on external sources of income, I think it's not reasonable to engage in these activities if more lucrative alternatives exist.

And considering France increasing public debt, I don't see how the situation is going to improve.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#363

Post by BuyMyBitcoins »

a-dub wrote: post #16
ekianjo wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

paying teachers more is not going to solve the problem that most people do not appreciate teachers whether its kids or parents. It is certainly not a job for those who cannot stand being criticized the whole time.

there is a way of expressing respect in market economies, it's called money.

Hedge fund managers make a killing and I have no respect for them whatsoever.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#364

Post by xivzgrev »

I’m frankly surprised schools haven’t collapsed. It seems like borderline abuse of teachers - low pay, undisciplined kids, have to buy your own supplies. Then this article also points out all the rules and people who think they know better than you.

When I have kids, I plan myself to be lead with respect of the teachers when I meet them

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#365

Post by jschveibinz »

I am an early-retired EE and I thought that I could have a second career in teaching HS physics. I got the MA Teaching in Maryland, and did my one year student teaching assignment. My thoughts:

1. The degree program was decent, although a certificate program would be better for prior professionals if the law allowed it (lower cost, too much wasted time in redundant classes).

2. Teachers are sad. Very sad. They are underpaid and overworked, even at the better suburban high schools. Parents treat them poorly, even when they are veteran teachers with lots of experience.

3. In general, the public resents that teachers get “3 months off” in the summer. I believe that this is the justification for lower pay. It is silly, because teachers work more in 9 months than most professionals and they also pay for things out of their own pockets. They also counsel and tutor students after school. It’s a difficult job.

4. In my job interviews, the first and most important qualification was “classroom control.” Math, science, engineering, life experience were all distant seconds. Teachers—-even in advanced math and science classes—-are first and foremost caretakers. Think about that for a second…

5. What is the current model for education based on? There are several competing historical arguments, but the salient factors like student-teacher ratio, subjects, grades, facilities, etc. are based on economics and legal requirements. The quality of either a student’s experience or a teacher’s experience is not very high on the list. Education is about checking a box on a list of requirements that was developed 150+ years ago.

Ultimately, I decided to tutor rather than to teach in a classroom. I consider this a personal disappointment, although I learned a lot from the educational experience. I wish there could be a “town hall” type of discussion to consider ways to improve the situation.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#366

Post by wiz21c »

FTA: "When you call someone burned out, it implies a personal moral failing on their part. The phrase shifts the conversation away from work conditions to a teacher’s individual personal choices."

So true... In other jobs too...

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#368

Post by tester756 »

sidlls wrote: post #30
a-dub wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there is a way of expressing respect in market economies, it's called money.

Money will not overcome the "those who can't, teach" sentiment that runs quite strongly in the US. There is a very strong anti-intelligence (not merely anti-intellectual) sentiment in this country. It will help, and we should certainly pay teachers more, but it isn't the whole solution.

>those who can't, teach

because those who can go to industry for real cash

I think.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#369

Post by mnd999 »

seibelj wrote: post #56
mnd999 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s a societal decision we have to make. Should all children have access to good education - i.e. should we invest in public schooling? Or should it be dependent on your parents ability to pay in which case lets go all in on private.

In my opinion, the voucher system is correct - keep funding public school through tax dollars, but give the parents a voucher for the amount to spend where they wish. If every parent in Boston received a $25,000 voucher to spend at the school they wished, competition would force public schools to improve or shut down as every school vied for the vouchers. Unlike many on the left, who despise monopolies in business an…

I would just ban private schools and home schooling entirely, and make everyone go to public schools. The standards would improve in no time.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#370

Post by educaysean »

rayiner wrote: post #286
dadoge wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we paid them more, it’d be easier to hold them to a higher standard

I’m all for creating a new salary band for teachers with 1300+ SAT scores and STEM degrees. I’ll pay whatever taxes you want for that.

So instead of putting in the work and weighing out the different qualities of an effective educator, you pick out the most arbitrary of criteria out there and want to make that the gold standard for evaluating teachers.

I'm not a betting man, but I'd feel comfortable wagering that you are a STEM grad with solid SAT scores.

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