Live data from Hacker News

Paris Shootings and Explosions Kill Over 100, Police Say

nytimes.com

261–270 of 672 posts

Re: Paris Shootings and Explosions Kill Over 100, Police Say

#261
post #208

I don't understand how can you talk about ISIS, Nazis and Communists in the same sentence? Communism has nothing to do with violence compared to ISIS and Nazis... Edit: Why downvotes? Idea of communism does not propose violence, Nazis and ISIS on the other hand do.

Why downvotes? At a wild guess, 100 million dead.

Re: Paris Shootings and Explosions Kill Over 100, Police Say

#262

I'm very curious about where the attackers got those firearms. France isn't as heavily disarmed as England, but it isn't exactly the United States for firearms availability; if any of the offenders' weapons can be recovered, I'm sure there will be interesting things to learn from their serial numbers.

Outlawing guns is a lot like outlawing drugs. If you want them, you can get them.

Drugs I could find. Guns? Wouldn't have a clue where to start.

Re: Paris Shootings and Explosions Kill Over 100, Police Say

#263
post #212
post #208

I don't understand how can you talk about ISIS, Nazis and Communists in the same sentence? Communism has nothing to do with violence compared to ISIS and Nazis... Edit: Why downvotes? Idea of communism does not propose violence, Nazis and ISIS on the other hand do.

I think he might be talking about Stalinism. Or at the very least, just Stalin.

I'm talking about Lenin (founder of the VChK/KGB), and Stalin, and Mao, and Pol Pot, and the Shining Path, and the Red Army Faction, and I could go on but the other names escape me. When a political movement kills more people than Hitler, I'm fine with mentioning it in the same breath as Hitler.

Re: Paris Shootings and Explosions Kill Over 100, Police Say

#264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Terrorism is usually a rational act. It is terrible, but it has political goals. This, for instance, may be aimed at ending the European involvement in Syria and their taking in refugees.

Having a logic is not the same as being rational. All madness has its own logic. I want a raise so I terrorize my boss until he gives me one is a logic, but it is not a rational approach.

Typically the irrationality is in the axioms, not the reasoning abilities.

Re: Paris Shootings and Explosions Kill Over 100, Police Say

#265
post #65
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do people think the refugees were running away from? Exactly these people.

Not European but travelling in Asia at the moment. Have had a couple of discussions with run-of-the-mill Europeans concerned that the refugees areproportionally made up much more of young men than women/children with the implication that these guys are up to no good. I'd say the subtleties of the humanitarian crisis is going to be lost on the average European Joe in the wake of this

> the refugees areproportionally made up much more of young men than women/children with the implication that these guys are up to no good.

You don't even have to imply that they are intentionally up to no good.

Groups of young men without possibilities of pairing off with young women are far more prone to crime and violence.

Re: Paris Shootings and Explosions Kill Over 100, Police Say

#266
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Basically, the French security system has been revealed as completely ineffective. How can a country possibly prevent these things while still maintaining a free society?

They can't; even the not free societies - think prisons - are not safe. People that want to do Bad Things will do them. Even if they didn't have guns or weapons, they could've - for example - get enough people into a dinner party or restaurant, have everyone grab a fork, and start stabbing people in the eye. Terrorism doesn't need weaponry. The only deterrent would be to read people's minds, and you've probably watch…

I'm a bit more optimistic, I think it can be fixed but it will take many years (decades).

Re: Paris Shootings and Explosions Kill Over 100, Police Say

#267

This soils the reputation of islam. I know some good people (muslims) who suffer from prejudice on a daily basis because of attacks like these. Being a muslim in a foreign country is an increasingly difficult and isolating experience.

Islam soils the reputation of islam. It has a massive problem of large percentages of Muslims supporting (or being okay with) violence and terrorism. 42% of young Muslims in France believe suicide bombings are justified (35% overall). http://www.pewresearch.org/files/old-assets/pdf/muslim-ameri...

I'm sure that if you did a survey of disenfranchised white youth in the US, you'd find a lot of people volunteering to enlist, and you could probably get some sympathy for the need to "go kill ISIS" or some other media-oriented headline. France has many issues, I doubt any of them are truly deeply connected to Islam. But it is of course easier to point at religion as the source of civil unrest, rather than at a failing economy, systematic discrimination and a growing divide between rich and poor.

Re: Paris Shootings and Explosions Kill Over 100, Police Say

#268

The repeated attacks, heavy immigration of refugees...I'm hoping for the best, but I feel like there is a powder keg here. Whether or not it is based in any fact, how this is handled and plays out is a serious concern.

Yes, people like to blame the outsider, no matter how ridiculous it is. Ever hear a news story about an angry partner killing a spouse? About a person stabbed to death in the street? Pushed in front of a train? Hit by a car? Most of these you'll never hear of because they're such routine daily occurrences. They're done by US! Normal local people who grew up here (wherever that might be).

Nevermind refugees. People everywhere are much more dangerous than any terrorists. Somehow we don't like the idea of banning everyone from everywhere so we feel justified in judging one group as more dangerous than another to give us a sense of safety.

Re: Paris Shootings and Explosions Kill Over 100, Police Say

#269
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I volunteered two different refugee camp constructions in Syrian border and I know the difference between a refugee camp and a homeless camp clearly.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calais_jungle

That's a queue to get to Britain. It's a weird effect of inter-EU collaboration that Britain's borders effectively start at the coast of France.

Re: Paris Shootings and Explosions Kill Over 100, Police Say

#270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It used to be rational, rather. The classic terrorists of the '70s wanted "a lot of people talking but not a lot of people dead" -- and also wanted to survive the experience. The new breed of terrorism in the '80s and '90s was different from those; the IRA, the PLO, and various state-sponsored terrorists in that period had/have more in common with each other, despite their obvious differences, than any have with al-Q…

> ISIS is specifically out for either world empire or apocalyptic defeat Which is why (in my understanding) ISIS does not do attacks on foreign soil. Their idea is to re-establish a caliphate (ei Islamic empire, which existed from around the time of Mohamed for centuries). ISIS would probably be okay with those that cannot join the jihad in Syria conducting a terrorist attack on their home turf, but would not activel…

They've inspired a lot of lone-wolf and copycat attacks, though, and I think they endorse the idea that if you can't get to Syria, you can at least kill people at home. I doubt that ISIS' actual government had anything to do with this, but the attackers were clearly thinking of ISIS -- "For Syria!" and all that.
Post reply on HN