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Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

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Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#171

Post by mncharity »

Liskni_si wrote: post #139
glitchc wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The trackpoint is the main reason I find it so hard to move away from Lenovo Thinkpads. The buttons under the spacebar alone are super convenient.

Not just hard - impossible. To the point of making it harder to find a job, as very few jobs let you use a non-Windows ThinkPad. (I mean yeah, of course AuDHD makes it harder to find a job, no surprise there. But it's a shame that laptop manufacturers make it even harder.)

> To the point of making it harder to find a job

Fwiw... (1) Lenovo sells compact keyboards with trackpoint. USB and bluetooth. There are mouse buttons below Space, but it cuts off there, with no pad. I once taped a kludgy bare usb pad to one, which was ok, but the extra couple of cm separation was annoying. I considered grinding out some of the case, but don't recall if that turned out plausible. (2) Lenovo has tablets with detachable keyboards, with both trackpoint and touchpad. People have DIYed such (from an old X1) into a USB kbd - the pogo pins did USB. Lenovo currently sells a replacement kbd for the X12, but I don't know if its similarly DIYable. (3) Assorted other manufacturers make, or have made, kbds with devices resembling touchpoint, more or less. (4) Some note ancient Lenovo IBM SK-8840 PS/2 Wired Keyboard With TrackPoint still show up on ebay, fwiw.

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#172

Post by oofbaroomf »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #106
doug_durham wrote: post #101

I use a trackpad to avoid virtually all of the issues created by a mouse. The trackpad gestures in macOS are magical.

What are the issues that a mouse creates?

Takes time to move your hand to it.

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#174

Post by andix »

mncharity wrote: post #171
Liskni_si wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just hard - impossible. To the point of making it harder to find a job, as very few jobs let you use a non-Windows ThinkPad. (I mean yeah, of course AuDHD makes it harder to find a job, no surprise there. But it's a shame that laptop manufacturers make it even harder.)

> To the point of making it harder to find a job Fwiw... (1) Lenovo sells compact keyboards with trackpoint. USB and bluetooth. There are mouse buttons below Space, but it cuts off there, with no pad. I once taped a kludgy bare usb pad to one, which was ok, but the extra couple of cm separation was annoying. I considered grinding out some of the case, but don't recall if that turned out plausible. (2) Lenovo has tabl…

> (1) Lenovo sells compact keyboards with trackpoint

Where can I get it? They stopped selling them around 2 years ago AFAIK. I have a few of them, but they are not very durable, so used ones are probably not a good option.

Only alternative I know of is https://tex.com.tw

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#175

Post by elxr »

NickNaraghi wrote: post #47

If you wanted to go in the other direction, you could achieve more productivity with faster mouse skills. The competitive FPS genre has spawned a bunch of aim training tools[0] to improve muscle memory. [0] https://www.3daimtrainer.com/

Maybe if you're doing a job that doesn't involve typing whatsoever, silly stuff like that competitive FPS adjacent mouse skills might help, but for 99% of us, this is just a complete waste of time.

Replacing software with poor keyboard navigation support with better, more modern alternatives will literally do 10x more for your productivity than faster mouse skills.

Mouse aim training has to be the saddest way to improve productivity I've seen anyone suggest.

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#176

Post by foobarbecue »

CalRobert wrote: post #77
foobarbecue wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only works for like 20% of the menus though. I remember alt shortcuts reliably being on every single menu in early Windows (95? ME? XP?)

Hah, I was thinking 3.1…

Yeah I only used it a little bit so couldn't remember if it had the "hold alt to see shortcuts" thing

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#177

Post by doug_durham »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #106
doug_durham wrote: post #101

I use a trackpad to avoid virtually all of the issues created by a mouse. The trackpad gestures in macOS are magical.

What are the issues that a mouse creates?

I have to lift up my hand and move my arm around to use it. With a trackpad all I need to do is move my hand over and flick my fingers for gestures. My wrist never moves.

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#178

Post by reddit_clone »

jonfw wrote: post #104
comboy wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously depends on your workflow but I think I use mouse only on websites on macos (with aerospace)

If you're interested in keyboard navigation of websites, consider a browser or extension with link hinting support! It worked really well in my experience a few years ago, although I've since became much more of a mouse guy and stopped using it. Qutebrowser was my favorite browser for keyboard navigation but firefox, chrome, etc. have extensions for this as well.

Vimium extension does that. Works well too. Works on Chrome and Firefox.

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#179

Post by elxr »

bobchadwick wrote: post #75
sirwitti wrote: post #60

Has anyone real-life experience with these tools?

Committed Mouseless user, here. I use a split keyboard that has a mouse layer, but I almost never use it, let alone an actual mouse or trackpad. Mouseless is so much more efficient for me. It did take a day or two to get used to using it (and to get used to comments from people who see your screen when it's active).

One to two days only? Might have to try it out then.

Thanks for the suggestion.

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#180

Post by elxr »

doug_durham wrote: post #177
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are the issues that a mouse creates?

I have to lift up my hand and move my arm around to use it. With a trackpad all I need to do is move my hand over and flick my fingers for gestures. My wrist never moves.

Wait till you hear about a trackpoint. To bad almost nothing comes with one anymore.

As someone on a mac trackpad right now, the only gesture I somewhat regularly use is drag-and-drop. Everything else I'd rather do on the keyboard.

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