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Australians ‘complacent’ to rapid growth in digital surveillance

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Re: Australians ‘complacent’ to rapid growth in digital surveillance

#161

Post by paranoidrobot »

6nf wrote: post #80
paranoidrobot wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AUD 300 billion to save 70,000 lives You keep quoting 300 billion, where are you getting that from?

https://budget.gov.au/2021-22/content/covid.htm Please explain how am I using this number incorrectly? What is the correct number I should be using instead?

It makes about as much sense to say that we spent $300B to save 70,000 people as it does to say that the US has spent trillions to kill 714,000.

One is not the cause of the other, in either direction.

Re: Australians ‘complacent’ to rapid growth in digital surveillance

#162

Post by postingawayonhn »

paranoidrobot wrote: post #154
postingawayonhn wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that when you make protests illegal and meet them with riot police only the most hardened/radical protesters will turn up. Of course there will end up being a little bit of violence. And to address the wider point of violence in protests is it not sometimes necessary? If you believe your government has become tyrannical and they are willing to use force against you then what other option do you have?

> The problem is that when you make protests illegal and meet them with riot police You've got that arse-about. They were met with regular uniformed police, like in the BLM protests that happened multiple times in the last 12-18 months. The BLM protesters managed to remain peaceful, didn't assault reporters, bystanders, or police, and didn't damage property. They protested, and then dispersed on their own. All while…

> They were met with regular uniformed police, like in the BLM protests that happened multiple times in the last 12-18 months.

There were uniformed police there as well but they were definitely met by public order response teams who are much more heavily armoured/equipped and travel around in vehicles with blacked out windows. [1] [2] [3]

[1] https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSXL5iC...

[2] https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSiM5bT...

[3] https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/cee5e8e0abbb5138fa1c8d40...

Re: Australians ‘complacent’ to rapid growth in digital surveillance

#163

Post by 0xdeadb00f »

ntSean wrote: post #58
spikepuppet wrote: post #4

As an Australian, I can definitely say I'm not complacent. The rise of all this surveillance here certainly unnerves me, and has definitely helped hasten my want to emmigrate ASAP.

You would immigrate to where exactly?

I have come to a similar conclusion. Where the fuck am I supposed to go? Everywhere has problems, shit laws, and social issues.

Re: Australians ‘complacent’ to rapid growth in digital surveillance

#164

Post by NoImmatureAdHom »

0xy wrote: post #128
Tomis02 wrote: post #69

Australian soldiers committing war crimes in Afghanistan? Nobody bats an eyelid. Can't go to Kmart because the government tries to fight the pandemic? Riots in the streets. And you're surprised there's complacency to digital surveillance, when people are more outraged by slight personal discomfort than by murder. It's not even criticism, just an observation. People are very comfortable in their bubble and do not care…

Boiling the current lockdown regime to "can't shop in stores" is needlessly dismissive and reductionist. The current policy in Australia is that foreign citizens are forbidden from leaving the country. This violates numerous international agreements on the freedom of movement for citizens, including ones Australia is signatory to. The only other countries preventing exit of foreign citizens are names like North Korea…

UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights:

Article 13

    Everyone has the right to leave any country, including his own, and to return to his country.

Re: Australians ‘complacent’ to rapid growth in digital surveillance

#165

Post by BLKNSLVR »

shitloadofbooks wrote: post #5

I don't think there's anything uniquely Australian about this. Australia is "first" because it is being used as the testing ground for this stuff, but the same playbook will be used in other countries in the coming years, especially those in which Murdoch's (a pretty unapologetic authoritarian) influences extend.

I agree that Australia is being used as the canary in the coalmine for these authoritarian-leaning laws because the Australian people are, in general, entirely apathetic to politics that doesn't immediately affect them (Australians historically vote for the simple, and therefore unlikely in reality, immediate advantage - often in the form of tax cuts or inverse threats of tax hikes - at the expense of the future) - which therefore normalises these laws for the rest of the 5-eyes / western world.

I have my thought-fingers around an idea to offer some kind of privacy-as-a-service service, but it'd have to be incorporated outside of Australia and its ownership made opaque through the use of shell companies - thankfully (/s) Australia has no legislation against conducting business in the country with such untraceable ownership (I think it was the Panama Papers that revealed both Wilson[0][1] Security and SA Power Networks[2][3] had opaque international ownership structures and it was essentially unknown which individuals were actually responsible for their operations - Wilson Security has government contracts and SA Power Networks literally run the power grid in South Australia).

Australia doesn't have a terrorism problem, and yet is leading the charge in writing legislation to combat it. It smells long-rotten, but most of the Australian population have their noses buried in their socials.

Australia has a corporate tax collection problem that neither side of government want to touch with a ten-foot pole.

The small fish are easy to catch and therefore easy to score political points from. Legislation follows from this realization.

[0]: https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/82965338/low-pro...

[1]: https://www.smh.com.au/business/wilson-security-implicated-a...

[2]: https://indaily.com.au/news/business/2016/04/05/sa-power-net...

[3]: https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/south-australia/sa-power...

Re: Australians ‘complacent’ to rapid growth in digital surveillance

#166

Post by taitems »

psychlops wrote: post #92
taitems wrote: post #64

Cries of "Tyranny!" and "Give me liberty or give me death" are imported concepts that don't resonate quite as well here in Australia. The pearl clutching "Save Australia" protests were good for a chuckle[1], but are also accompanied by people advocating we rise up and murder our police[2]? When Florida has 50x the per capita death rate than that of Australia, it's pretty clear that the US chose liberty AND death[3].…

Pretty sure the primary conversation isn't about now, but the future and more about what your kids inherit. I don't think the 50x metric will stand the test of time, but wish you all the best.

I'm not sure I understand what you mean but the Florida 50x metric not standing the test of time?

Even if you were to look at it on a national level, the US death rate per million is 2,142, the Australian death rate per million is... 56. That's a 38x rate.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_pandemic_death_rates_...

Re: Australians ‘complacent’ to rapid growth in digital surveillance

#167

Post by postingawayonhn »

nhinck wrote: post #137
grecy wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically, Australians are currently not even permitted to leave the country!

Source please.

> Australia’s borders are currently closed and international travel from Australia remains strictly controlled to help prevent the spread of COVID-19. International travel from Australia is only available if you are exempt or you have been granted an individual exemption.

https://covid19.homeaffairs.gov.au/leaving-australia

Re: Australians ‘complacent’ to rapid growth in digital surveillance

#168

Post by postingawayonhn »

prawn wrote: post #127
grecy wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically, Australians are currently not even permitted to leave the country!

I know of a family who moved to the US within the last 12 months. Has that been a more recent change that would've prevented them leaving at all?

You can apply for an exemption and moving your residence would normally be permitted.

Re: Australians ‘complacent’ to rapid growth in digital surveillance

#169

Post by 0xdeadb00f »

shirro wrote: post #44
e67f70028a46fba wrote: post #9

They aren’t complacent. They are harassed, beaten and arrested if they object. Absolutely disgusting what the government there is doing to our Australian brothers and sisters. And of course no media coverage to speak of in the states.

There have been emergency health measures in place in a couple of states but most states have very few restrictions. Australians pay much less for health care than most places and our health system is run very lean so we have to be cautious until we reach vaccination targets. If they let it rip there would be even more people protesting that they couldn't get into hospital. Everything is open where I live. Plenty of…

This. Thank you

IMO if the states that are in the mud had taken proper precautions before they did, they wouldn't be in this mess and the cops wouldn't have had an opportunity to abuse their power like they definitely are in say, NSW.

Re: Australians ‘complacent’ to rapid growth in digital surveillance

#170

Post by NoImmatureAdHom »

Voltage wrote: post #135

As an Australian, is the best approach to encrypt all my storage and communications? Is that even possible when the potential threat is the government?

This is always the best approach. It's not like you need to make it perfect and unbreakable, just annoying enough to get in to relative to the value of doing so.
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