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The Facebook bubble just popped

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Re: The Facebook bubble just popped

#161

Post by gdulli »

downandout wrote: post #151
gdulli wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't have a college degree, and I don't consider myself a racist redneck. I don't know where you're getting this from.

You replied to a comment about how Tom Brokaw literally said on national TV that Trump voters were uneducated racist rednecks that watch Duck Dynasty. In that reply, you defended his position. That's where I'm getting it from.

Did he actually call them rednecks? Do you have a link to that? That sounds like an unprofessional thing for a journalist to say. Level of education is a straightforward fact in the makeup of Trump's voters, and that his views are racist is demonstrable. But if Brokaw really used a slur, he shouldn't have.

Re: The Facebook bubble just popped

#162

Post by DubiousPusher »

ptaipale wrote: post #147
DubiousPusher wrote: post #33

Why is this hard for people to get. "I can't believe it," is a figure of speech not a statement of fact. Most of us are shocked that this could happen not that it did happen.

Do you mean that even if Clinton would have won the election, you would still have been shocked? Because even if she did win, Trump could have won, as many pollsters predicted he has a double-digit chance of winning?

Without reservation yes. I have been in a state of shock for months now. The frustration of the reality is what makes it bubble over into visible outpourings.

My assumption wasn't that because no one I interacted with on social media was supporting him therefore he can't win.

My assumption was that people are too basically decent for him to win.

There's a lot of ground between knowing something can happen and being emotionally prepared for it to happen.

Re: The Facebook bubble just popped

#163

Post by renaudg »

jbondeson wrote: post #44
sickbeard wrote: post #12

Not to mention realclearpolitics and projectthirtyfive all had poll after poll with all the number crunching data saying Clinton would win. In the end.. clinton: 59,938,290 votes trump: 59,704,886 votes 59million liked all new age sjw stuff 59million other people didn't

> 59million liked all new age sjw stuff That is such an absurd and reductionist dismissal of this election that is no different than the equally wrong people saying "59 million people liked all the old sexist, homophobic, racist and xenophobic attitudes, and 59 million other people didn't" What you are doing here is just perpetuating the problems that have plagued this election cycle and made it so people are complet…

He's actually not that wrong if you think about it. This cultural divide was a major issue : https://reason.com/blog/2016/11/09/trump-won-because-leftist...

Re: The Facebook bubble just popped

#164

Post by dlp211 »

ianai wrote: post #70
misterbowfinger wrote: post #36

We're all definitely in an echo chamber. Hacker News is an echo chamber. So is Reddit, FB, Twitter, etc. This is what happens when, as an industry, we move towards "personalization". All of our "personalized" feeds allow businesses to increase their ad revenue, but it siphons us away from the rest of the world. 30 years ago, we were beholden to the large media outlets, which is also bad, but I believe we've overcorre…

It has everything to do with human behavior. It takes energy and induces cognitive load to interact with 'the other' - other people, other view points, etc. So people group up by like interests. Technology just makes it possible to highly concentrate.

I agree, but I think this goes beyond technology at this point. I hypothesize that we are self-segregating as a nation into Rural and Urban tribes and this is going to cause a lot of pain for half the country and further erode the trust in our institutions. I think we are on a dark path, not because a Republican won, but because we can't effectively govern by coming together and being nuanced and compromising.

Re: The Facebook bubble just popped

#165

Post by ptaipale »

gipp wrote: post #116
thewhitetulip wrote: post #92

I find it funny that those who vouched for free speech have been trashing Trump's supporters all this election, too much talk for free speech eh?

I'm not sure what you're talking about? Free speech is about legality of speech; nobody's talked about locking anyone up for supporting a candidate.

Locking up isn't the only way to punish people. There's actually some talk about e.g. firing someone from his/her job for supporting a candidate. Recently, there was a long discussion chain in HN about how Y Combinator should sever any ties to Peter Thiel because he supported Trump. That Thiel "should be fired".

Discrimination at work may also be about free speech.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12733024

Re: The Facebook bubble just popped

#166

Post by herbst »

renaudg wrote: post #154
herbst wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As mention, but i am glad to do it again. I AM NOT AMERICAN Edit:// To further clearify: Nether are any of my facebook friends, nether have i ever been there or plan to. I have no relation with the U.S. i was just making the point that Facebook might simply is not the right place to find information.

I'm not American either. I'm French, living in the UK, and the figures are probably not very different here.

Honestly, i can imagine the UK beeing not much different.

Around here Facebook lost its appeal some time ago and mutated to a semi relevant social network. People (especially teens) use a lot Whatsapp & Snapchat now. We mostly stopped having requests for facebook marketing campaigns as well since a few years. And businesses slowly stopped to maintain their Facebook sites.

Please dont project your english environment into my german bubble. Thanks

Re: The Facebook bubble just popped

#167

Post by AcerbicZero »

mattzito wrote: post #142
AcerbicZero wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the issue is more with the false equivalency presented by some journalists. A college degree or lack there of, does not automatically denote greater or lesser intelligence.

It's not designated as a measure of intelligence, instead as a level of education, which comes along with correlations to profession, income level, religious identification (non-college educated folks are more likely to identify as evangelical), etc. etc.

I agree with you, although the original point was that there were individuals in the media who appeared to suggest not having a college education == unintelligent.

Re: The Facebook bubble just popped

#168

Post by zzalpha »

jbondeson wrote: post #119
zzalpha wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could be, but personally I'm done with being silent and just chuckling silently to myself or rolling my eyes when people pull out these infotainment zingers disguised as "insight". I agree. Throwing a derogatory zinger out there like "SJW" (which is unquestionably a dog whistle... anyone who would claim otherwise is being dishonest) does nothing to enhance public discourse, and it's about time we all worked to recogn…

It's not just that, it's also the people who want to trot out "hur hur hur, only uneducated people voted for Trump" I'm just so sick of all the navel gazing going on between the Bernie or Bust'ers, the Establishment Dems, the NeverTrumps, the Pro-Trumps, the Libertarians, and on and on and on. Every last one of them is pushing some absurdly reductionist hot take argument in their bubbles and papering over the real is…

I couldn't agree more.

I'm as liberal as they get, but Trump appealed to a broad demographic. Reducing it to "uneducated whites" does a disservice to the very foundations of American democracy, as it dismisses out of hand the very real concerns of nearly 50% of the American electorate.

It would behoove everyone, including those in the media and the political system, to step back and get in touch with the values and concerns of those folks. Without that, the US is only going to become more polarized... and I'm not sure how much longer that can go on.

Re: The Facebook bubble just popped

#169

Post by downandout »

mattzito wrote: post #142
AcerbicZero wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the issue is more with the false equivalency presented by some journalists. A college degree or lack there of, does not automatically denote greater or lesser intelligence.

It's not designated as a measure of intelligence, instead as a level of education, which comes along with correlations to profession, income level, religious identification (non-college educated folks are more likely to identify as evangelical), etc. etc.

Donald Trump - a serial philanderer that has been married three times - hardly had any appeal to evangelicals. The reality is that a huge chunk of votes for Trump were anti-Hillary votes, not pro-Trump votes. You don't have to be an uneducated redneck, as Brokaw and other liberals believe, to have serious problems with Hillary Clinton.

I live in Nevada - a "battleground state" - and I saw almost no pro-Hillary commercials or campaign flyers. Rather, she ran almost entirely on an anti-Trump platform. She didn't think anyone wanted to know her stances on the issues. Running that kind of campaign is dangerous when your own likability is a serious issue.

Re: The Facebook bubble just popped

#170

Post by neves »

Pigo wrote: post #58
woodchuck64 wrote: post #15

Not just the left and right's echo-chambers, but those who attempt to actually listen to reality got it wrong, too: FiveThirtyEight for example has been using proven, reality-based statistics for a while and should have predicted this result. (As it was, Silver was lambasted for being too generous on Trump's chances.) At issue in this election is apparently a new idea: people who hold positions that are being publica…

Is it uncommon that I can't ever recall being asked who I'd likely vote for? I suppose there's been a website once or twice that I've clicked a button on, but no one has ever asked me, or called me, or even handed me a survey that I can think of. What is the most common to actually make the inquiries.

And you probably don't know anyone who has been asked. This is the power of statistics.
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