So they operate illegally, pay no taxes and still make no money. I don't get it.
Uber Bonds Term Sheet Reveals $470M in Operating Losses
51–60 of 137 posts
Re: Uber Bonds Term Sheet Reveals $470M in Operating Losses
#52I've been pondering how you'd break the uber lock on the market. I mean, I use Uber and not Lyft 'cause there are more Uber drivers, so on average, the car is gonna be there faster if I use Uber. However, if I had an app on my phone to check the nearest uber and the nearest lyft and the nearest whatever else? that would remove the barrier to entry that Uber has set up. in that case (at least when lyft had a nearby ca…
You could break the Uber lock
on the market if supply and demand are not sufficiently random to require Uber's marketplace to coordinate.
That is, if it is usually convenient for Joe to depart from work at a certain hour and this is a time when Maureen typically likes to drive, both Joe and Maureen could potentially disintermediate Uber and split the marginal gain. This solution could look like a simple payments app, ride scheduler, and a local 'I'm here' function.
Another option could be to structure the market to enable 'teams' of drivers (ie like a taxi company brand). Allow these teams to find further operational gains through pooling resources and greater coordination. This solution would re-imagine the Uber market and driver tools for full-time workers.
Re: Uber Bonds Term Sheet Reveals $470M in Operating Losses
#53Earlier quoted context omitted.
Having worked for financial traders I won't call them the very worst company in the world. But if my choices were working for them or quitting the industry, I wouldn't blink. For me it's more the accumulation of awfulness. They started out as a scheme to time-share limos among young entitled dudebros. They entered the market with the black cars, exploiting a status-good dynamic. They've shifted all of the capital cos…
'In the Uber model we'll get paid only during the instants we are directly useful to somebody with money.' I'm sorry, but that sounds more like the efficiency that capitalism optimizes towards.
...which doesn't make it morally right.
Re: Uber Bonds Term Sheet Reveals $470M in Operating Losses
#54Tangential to OP: How does HN feel about the "evilness" of Uber? At my school the general feel is that Uber is pretty evil, notably for its attitudes towards its drivers as well as towards Lyft.
Uber is a net positive I believe. Irrespective of what others think of their practices the product is substantially superior to any alternatives I have pwrrsonally used.
"It's better than a taxicab so that excuses literally all of the bogus, often illegal shit Uber is doing."
Riiiiiiight.
Re: Uber Bonds Term Sheet Reveals $470M in Operating Losses
#55Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm still surprised that Uber is entering such competitive markets. I mean, in much of the western world, they're using a mobile app to side step cab hailing laws and break long standing taxi oligopolies. Does anyone know what market flaws they're solving in India and Asia?
In China the taxi oligopolies are very strong and the taxis are notorious for poor service. In Beijing, they come with their doors locked and roll the windows down to ask you where you want to go, to see if they feel like going in that direction.
Don't Uber drivers do the same by just not choosing fares that go to certain locations?
Re: Uber Bonds Term Sheet Reveals $470M in Operating Losses
#56This just shows that there is not much margin in this industry. They are essentially buying market share. However, as soon as Uber try to squeeze out some profit, they'll be undercut by the competitors.
It shows that they're fighting very hard to become the monopoly player because they know that the lock in from the network effects of the taxi market are worth way more than $500 million.
There is no network effect. As soon as you pay the drivers more, and charge the riders less, they will install your app. What keeps drivers and riders from checking both Uber and SuperDuperUber apps at the same time to make/save some extra money?
Re: Uber Bonds Term Sheet Reveals $470M in Operating Losses
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm still surprised that Uber is entering such competitive markets. I mean, in much of the western world, they're using a mobile app to side step cab hailing laws and break long standing taxi oligopolies. Does anyone know what market flaws they're solving in India and Asia?
If you think taxis are bad in the US, they are 10x worse outside of it.
Maybe in the 3rd world, but I consistently hear that they are good in Germany: nice cars, show up on time, well trained drivers, overinsured, cheap.
Re: Uber Bonds Term Sheet Reveals $470M in Operating Losses
#58There was a comment thread earlier today about whether Uber is solving rich-people problems or common-people problems. I wonder the extent to which Uber's pricing is sustainable -- are they subsidizing uberX and uberPOOL pricing out of money they're raising, or are the debts just in the pursuit of growth to new cities? Or put another way, if they ceased all growth, froze prices, and laid off all engineering and marke…
They solved the "hail a taxi by pressing a button on your smartphone problem". It's not really subsidized, if they weren't setting piles of money on fire trying to grow really fast(and taking moonshots on autonomous cars), they would definitely be profitable.
Re: Uber Bonds Term Sheet Reveals $470M in Operating Losses
#59This is really interesting. I believe this might be attribute to all the Uber promotions in Asia. I have heard from all my friends in India/China that Uber rides are actually free for around 10-15 rides. Also, they are giving tons of money to Drivers to promote Uber in India. An average Uber driver in Bangalore earns 110000 INR per month where as an entry level software engineer in GOOG/AMZN in India earns 80000 INR/…
I'm still surprised that Uber is entering such competitive markets. I mean, in much of the western world, they're using a mobile app to side step cab hailing laws and break long standing taxi oligopolies. Does anyone know what market flaws they're solving in India and Asia?
In Bangkok:
* I'm yet to have an Uber driver clearly on methamphetamine, but a notable number of taximeter drivers
* No quibbling over the price or trying to overcharge from Uber
* Uber cars always have seatbelts, it's rare to find them in the back seat of taximeters
* Even if the Uber driver doesn't know the place you're going to, they've got a map, and directions, and they'll use them
* No worrying about if you've got sufficient loose change; you can be sure the taximeter driver will have a real shortage currently if you have only big notes
And on and on and on...
Re: Uber Bonds Term Sheet Reveals $470M in Operating Losses
#60There was a comment thread earlier today about whether Uber is solving rich-people problems or common-people problems. I wonder the extent to which Uber's pricing is sustainable -- are they subsidizing uberX and uberPOOL pricing out of money they're raising, or are the debts just in the pursuit of growth to new cities? Or put another way, if they ceased all growth, froze prices, and laid off all engineering and marke…
They solved the "hail a taxi by pressing a button on your smartphone problem". It's not really subsidized, if they weren't setting piles of money on fire trying to grow really fast(and taking moonshots on autonomous cars), they would definitely be profitable.
Having used the apps that literally hail a taxi through a smartphone button, I feel compelled to note that Uber has solved a lot more than that. They've also solved the utterly miserable taxi experience that follows pressing the button.