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Going undercover as a sex worker

aljazeera.com

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Re: Going undercover as a sex worker

#111

Post by DanBC »

danparsonson wrote: post #42
pcthrowaway wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If their choice is to watch themselves or their families starve or die of disease, or to go to a likely death in terrible work conditions where they can at least help their families with the money they earn, it's not really much of a choice at all.

Quite right but it is still a choice, they at least have some agency. I'm not in any way attempting to downplay the awful situations we're discussing, but there is still a significant psychological difference between "I'm doing this to make my life and my families lives better" and "This is being done to me against my will for other peoples' benefit", is there not?

There are many men who agree to go and work for someone, and who are then forced into labour. If they try to leave they are chased and sometimes beaten or mutilated or killed.

People mean different things when they say "wage slave". It's an imprecise term and it leads to confusion.

But bonded labour leads to some horrific abuses of men, women, and children.

Forced child trafficking: http://m.irinnews.org/Report/94721/AFRICA-High-cost-of-child...

Ugandan women forced into sex work: http://m.irinnews.org/Report/95013/UGANDA-Women-trafficked-i...

A sixteen year old woman who escaped the LRA after years of rape is now an entrepreneur: http://www.unhcr.org.uk/news-and-views/news-list/news-detail...

Re: Going undercover as a sex worker

#112

Post by DanBC »

smorrow wrote: post #26
anon3_ wrote: post #18

"Human trafficking" is a deceiving word. It is all too often used by people on the payroll of these organizations. It invokes imagery that doesn't anywhere near equate reality. I advise you to avoid puff pieces, find the truth in actual journals and save your compassion for things on a case-by-case basis. For those who aren't aware, there is another side to the story. There are many people who inflate these statistic…

This is a perfectly valid comment until it's proven wrong. I don't think it should be "LA LA LA I'm not list-en-ing"-downvoted.

It is conspiracy theory bollocks until they provide some urls to support their bizzare claims.

Re: Going undercover as a sex worker

#113

Post by nailer »

jordigh wrote: post #101
thret wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Australia? It is legal here. It isn't something people talk about much, but that doesn't mean it is a taboo.

Are the prostitutes in Australia typically poor immigrant women? Wealthy, powerful women with a broad spectrum of choices do not typically choose prostitution.

Urban brothels are the most common type of sex work in Australia, and are legal, inspected (and frequented) by the police, very well paid, and generally women of all classes, primarily born in Australia but also China and other Asian countries.

See http://www.nswp.org/sites/nswp.org/files/NSWSexIndustryRepor... There are other interesting things including 'Sex workers’ reasons for choosing current workplace' was 'Hours are flexible' and 'the LASH study found no evidence that any of the women had been coerced into working in a brothel'

Street walking prostitutes are generally illegal, and unregistered brothels are illegal.

Check out http://www.scarletalliance.org.au/research/ for more research.

Re: Going undercover as a sex worker

#114

Post by facepalm »

tsunamifury wrote: post #5

I worked with the author, Mimi, at UC Berkeley and she took enormous risks in the Middle East and Moldovia for the sake of getting her story. Several others did as well including my two collegues who spent two years locked up in Iran after being lured across the border while reporting in Iraq. Funding for investigative journalism has all but completely dried up, due to disruption for Silicon Valley and other factors.…

Maybe I overlooked something in the story, but I don't quite understand how she did it? For example she describes three girls locked into a backroom of a family, living on a couple of bananas a day. How did she get that story? I don't think she posed as one of those girls, nor does it sound as if those girls would ever go out?

Re: Going undercover as a sex worker

#116

Post by facepalm »

jordigh wrote: post #96
dataker wrote: post #58

I live in a country where prostitution is legal and not taken as taboo. All I can say is that it makes things easier for everybody. Many use their bodies as a "small business", having their own personal marketing, credit card processor and online clients, increasing and improving their portfolio. Because they have such leverage, they end up being strict on what they'd do and even who their client is. In case somethin…

> All I can say is that it makes things easier for everybody. Which country is that? The Netherlands, Austria and Germany, for example, all have horrible trafficking problems. In Nevada, the women are ostracised and harrassed by the police at the legal brothels. In New Zealand, the police cannot tell the difference between legal prostitution and illegal pimping. So which country are you in that is doing better than t…

Do you have some numbers+sources? I live in Germany and the official statement from the police seems to be that it is not actually a huge problem.

Re: Going undercover as a sex worker

#117

Post by s_baby »

This has been going on for a thousand years in the region. The Ottoman empire was constantly capturing slaves from the Balkans and East Europe. It was a cornerstone of their civilization. Slavery was abolished in the 19th century but the market just moved underground.

Re: Going undercover as a sex worker

#118

Post by bhousel »

facepalm wrote: post #114
tsunamifury wrote: post #5

I worked with the author, Mimi, at UC Berkeley and she took enormous risks in the Middle East and Moldovia for the sake of getting her story. Several others did as well including my two collegues who spent two years locked up in Iran after being lured across the border while reporting in Iraq. Funding for investigative journalism has all but completely dried up, due to disruption for Silicon Valley and other factors.…

Maybe I overlooked something in the story, but I don't quite understand how she did it? For example she describes three girls locked into a backroom of a family, living on a couple of bananas a day. How did she get that story? I don't think she posed as one of those girls, nor does it sound as if those girls would ever go out?

My guess is that the local police eventually shut down that brothel and she later was able to interview someone involved - one of the prostitute, family member, police, etc?

It is very reasonable in cases like this for her to leave out some of the details about her sources.

Re: Going undercover as a sex worker

#119

Post by facepalm »

bhousel wrote: post #118
facepalm wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe I overlooked something in the story, but I don't quite understand how she did it? For example she describes three girls locked into a backroom of a family, living on a couple of bananas a day. How did she get that story? I don't think she posed as one of those girls, nor does it sound as if those girls would ever go out?

My guess is that the local police eventually shut down that brothel and she later was able to interview someone involved - one of the prostitute, family member, police, etc? It is very reasonable in cases like this for her to leave out some of the details about her sources.

I don't expect her to reveal sources. I just had troubles following the story. I didn't understand how the banana story came into the story out of the blue.

Re: Going undercover as a sex worker

#120

Post by Ygg2 »

a_bonobo wrote: post #74
Ygg2 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That wasn't the case with Germany. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_Germany It seems to reduce the violence against workers, but increases human trafficking, because Germany now acts as a safe haven for traffickers. Maybe trafficking would disappear, if all societies made prostitution illegal and not a looked down profession, but I somehow doubt it[1]. So if your goal is to reduce human trafficking, it m…

I don't agree with your points - they echo the recent campaign by Spiegel Online; looking at your Wikipedia article, it seems more to be an issue with open borders and no passport control, and the fact that Germany is in the "middle" of Europe and a relatively rich country, which makes Germany a good target for trafficking. The numbers of yearly cases seem to be fairly low (about 700-800 cases per year in your Wiki-a…

You do make a fine point that case regarding unemployment status.

But, I think there is a difference between legalizing prostitution and preventing what's essentially human enslavement.

I'm not saying legalizing prostitution won't help or shouldn't be done, I just don't think it will have as big impact as people claimed, and that it will have possible negative impact if other states don't adopt it.

IMO it's akin to legalizing drugs, just legalizing it won't make drug problem disappear. For instance in cases where some states legalized drugs and most didn't; a state that legalized drugs can become safe haven for criminals from other countries, where drugs aren't legal.

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