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Clampdown on cold call companies unveiled by government

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Clampdown on cold call companies unveiled by government

#41

Post by KhalPanda »

jblok wrote: post #16

My method is as follows: - I don't have a landline phone - If someone calls my mobile and they aren't in my address book, I just don't answer. - If that number is withheld I especially don't answer - If they leave a message I will listen to it and respond if necessary - If the number is not whitheld but not in my phone book, I google it, and if it is a legitimate business, it will usually show a match on the company…

Same here. I love the Android feature that will display the company name (if it can find it/it's linked to a Google business listing) of whichever number is calling. Saves me Googling at least half the time.

Re: Clampdown on cold call companies unveiled by government

#42

Post by eitally »

jblok wrote: post #16

My method is as follows: - I don't have a landline phone - If someone calls my mobile and they aren't in my address book, I just don't answer. - If that number is withheld I especially don't answer - If they leave a message I will listen to it and respond if necessary - If the number is not whitheld but not in my phone book, I google it, and if it is a legitimate business, it will usually show a match on the company…

This is my method, too. The only problem I have is that it seems about half the companies who cold call sales leads use some software that spoofs a local exchange, and I do generally answer the phone -- even when it's not one of my known contacts -- when it originates from my home area code. Not doing so risks missing calls from contractors, schools, kids' friends, my friends, etc.

Re: Clampdown on cold call companies unveiled by government

#43

Post by pzxc »

alex8022 wrote: post #33
kodis wrote: post #20

It seems as though at least for smart phones this could be easily solved through technological means similar to those used for screening email, something along the lines of a spam classification system. I envision my phone having a white list of known good numbers, which would be allowed to cause my phone to ring like it does now; a black list of known bad numbers, which would be immediately dropped; and a catch-all…

I use Mr Number Blocker for this on android. You can whitelist / blacklist specific numbers, and set it to hang up or go to voicemail. There's also a crowdsourcing aspect, where after a certain number of people flag a number as spam, it shows up as "likely spam" when the phone rings. I believe you can have those go straight to voicemail as well.

You don't need an app. Just add a contact called "SPAM", and set it to go straight to voicemail. Then any spam numbers who call you, just add their number to your SPAM contact.

Re: Clampdown on cold call companies unveiled by government

#44

Post by AndrewKemendo »

wpietri wrote: post #39
AndrewKemendo wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No? Then it's probably a cold call and you're just annoying people. Sorry but this is naiive. Cold calling works, and not because you are bugging people. You know that "prior relationship" you mention? Well it has to start somewhere and a call is as good as any.

If your definition of "works" is "is rewarding for the perp", then sure all sorts of things "work". Theft, fraud, and extortion, for example, all work wonderfully well -- for the mafia. Our laws are mainly about things that "work", because if they didn't work, people wouldn't do them enough to matter. Your mistake is not accounting for the negative externalities. Cold calling and spam both can "work" for the sending…

sucker into whatever they're pushing

This is the same "If you build it they will come" logic that doom so many startups. The reality is that even if you have a perfect solution to someone's problem you still have to go sell it to them. Uber started with cold calls, so did many other successful startups. It's the lowest barrier to entry there is.

Lets also differentiate between b2b cold calls which is what I have in mind mostly, and b2c cold calling. I think the latter is probably magnitudes less effective and more "sleazy" than the former and there are better ways of targeting advertising at individual consumers at this point.

Re: Clampdown on cold call companies unveiled by government

#45

Post by wpietri »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #44
wpietri wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your definition of "works" is "is rewarding for the perp", then sure all sorts of things "work". Theft, fraud, and extortion, for example, all work wonderfully well -- for the mafia. Our laws are mainly about things that "work", because if they didn't work, people wouldn't do them enough to matter. Your mistake is not accounting for the negative externalities. Cold calling and spam both can "work" for the sending…

sucker into whatever they're pushing This is the same "If you build it they will come" logic that doom so many startups. The reality is that even if you have a perfect solution to someone's problem you still have to go sell it to them. Uber started with cold calls, so did many other successful startups. It's the lowest barrier to entry there is. Lets also differentiate between b2b cold calls which is what I have in m…

It is the same logic only if you believe there is no possible way to sell people other than cold calls. Otherwise it is different logic. But hey, nice straw man. Maybe you'll feel better if you attack it some more?

Your point that cold calling works is repetitive, and was previously addressed.

And of course you believe that the thing you did/want to do is less sleazy. All people doing sleazy things believe that whatever they're doing is in fact ok, or at least justifiable. That's what we humans are really good at: justifying our own particular bullshit.

Re: Clampdown on cold call companies unveiled by government

#46

Post by bediger4000 »

wpietri wrote: post #37
bediger4000 wrote: post #21

The US Do Not Call list seemed pretty good at cutting the number of cold calls substantially. The remaining cold calls are clearly illegal (in the US). This situation seems vaguely like the Tragedy of the Commons to me. I've decided to listen all the way through the recording speech - these evil psychos can only have a finite number of interactive response units, so monopolizing one of the for as long as possible cut…

I have been there, but I decided that the human operators were still human. So now rather than turning rage-monster at them, I take up their time trying to persuade them that they deserve a better job, that they don't have to waste their lives working as a criminal who lies to people for a living.

They're still human, but they also resist all attempts at my communicating anything other than "I'm a dope, and I'm falling for your scam." I've tried asking to be put on no-call lists, asking to be referred to supervisors, and telling them to quit before they're indicted. I mostly got instant hang ups. A few times, I got laughter. Now, I waste their time. I keep an expired Visa-brand gift card in my wallet so I can give them a credit card number that passes cursory checks.

Everyone should be wasting "Anne from Cardholder Services" time. The victim of the tragedy should be their commons, not ours. They are the lawbreakers, they are the deliberate bad actors.

Re: Clampdown on cold call companies unveiled by government

#47

Post by ColinWright »

DanBC wrote: post #34
ColinWright wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I belong to the TPS, and I still get a dozen cold calls a day. When I ask where they got my details from they simply say it came up on their system. When I ask for their details they hang up. When I call 1471 it's an unlisted number. Currently there is no viable way to prevent these calls, or to get off their lists.

You ask them for their business name. You then report them to TPS.

They won't give it until you're a long way through their script. They always try to deflect questions like that by telling you how wonderful they are, or what they're going to do for you. They know the risks of giving their business name too early, and craft the script accordingly.

Re: Clampdown on cold call companies unveiled by government

#48

Post by vmilner »

Silhouette wrote: post #10
ColinWright wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I belong to the TPS, and I still get a dozen cold calls a day. When I ask where they got my details from they simply say it came up on their system. When I ask for their details they hang up. When I call 1471 it's an unlisted number. Currently there is no viable way to prevent these calls, or to get off their lists.

I've seen plenty of reports suggesting that being on the TPS can actually increase the volume of nuisance calls you get (though so far never with solid, public data to support the claim). I do know for a fact that although adding a number to the TPS is supposed to be permanent, I have reregistered the same number multiple times after being told that it was not currently registered. Given that the phone companies seem…

trueCall seems to work well for me. I let all mobile calls straight through, and those from my local phone area and those where the people who ring me most live.

Everyone else gets asked to press '3' (say) to get through. I can imagine some issues - e.g. those automated calls that say your credit card's been used in Outer Mongolia, and I'm a bit concerned that the extra hurdle could be a problem in an emergency situation, but I haven't had a cold-call (on my landline) for 3 years.

Re: Clampdown on cold call companies unveiled by government

#49

Post by Silhouette »

vmilner wrote: post #48
Silhouette wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've seen plenty of reports suggesting that being on the TPS can actually increase the volume of nuisance calls you get (though so far never with solid, public data to support the claim). I do know for a fact that although adding a number to the TPS is supposed to be permanent, I have reregistered the same number multiple times after being told that it was not currently registered. Given that the phone companies seem…

trueCall seems to work well for me. I let all mobile calls straight through, and those from my local phone area and those where the people who ring me most live. Everyone else gets asked to press '3' (say) to get through. I can imagine some issues - e.g. those automated calls that say your credit card's been used in Outer Mongolia, and I'm a bit concerned that the extra hurdle could be a problem in an emergency situa…

Thanks for sharing. I hadn't realised it could do things like permitting all callers from a certain area.

For what it's worth, I've had the occasional issues with both business and personal cards being used abroad -- usually when someone forgot to tell the computer about the foreign travel they had been duly informed about weeks in advance -- but I have never had anything but a real person call and then, if I wasn't able to answer, leave a real message. I guess some places might use auto-diallers for this, but it doesn't seem to be the norm in the UK if my experience is representative.

Actually, an absurd proportion of these people call, and then if I am there to answer, the caller starts by announcing that they're from my bank/card provider and then immediately dives into "Before I can talk to you about this, I just need to ask you some security questions to confirm your identity...", but that's another story. :-)

Re: Clampdown on cold call companies unveiled by government

#50

Post by lylebarrere »

rayiner wrote: post #15
lylebarrere wrote: post #3

The Do Not Call database in the US has never been effective because the type of company making these spammy calls doesn't care if they are breaking the law. There is no enforcement effort to track them down.

Do you remember what things were like before the Do Not Call database? We would get one or more marketing calls a day on our home phone (landline). These days, maybe once a month.

I've been on it for years as well as the DNC database for caregivers of elderly patients with diminished capacity and I receive more than 5 calls per day.
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