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How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

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Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#61
post #19

By the way, check out the sheer size of the protests via drone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZ7r8qi3NIY Near the middle they fly higher and zoom out and what you thought was large before turns out to be massive.

And then you watch the news reports daytime and realize what you thought was massive during night was pretty small after all.

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#62
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Police Radios (and GMRS, and FRS) are not neighboring bands to 802.11

Does China use the same frequency bands as US?

Looking at this document (http://www.ncc.gov.tw/english/files/07060/92_070605_1.pdf) it's not immediately clear. A ctrl-F for "emergency" and "police" yields no results.

However, there is a FRS band which is the same as the US.

Moreover, the bands used by "push-to-talk" radios are ones that transmit reasonably far for lowish power and penetrate walls. No reason to think they'll be different worldwide.

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#63
post #56
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since when did defending your territory became 'ethnic cleansing'? Remind me, who went over the border? In a Ukrainian conflict, why do we keep hearing about Russian soldiers? Oh, and by the way, where did the bodies of 4000 dead Russian soldiers go? Wait, how did they get to Ukraine in the first place? http://euromaidanpress.com/2014/09/27/rights-activist-4000-r... And please, don't quite RT.

if not for Russian volunteers and hardware (and soldiers in the August) the Donbass would be blood bathed. It is a duty of the international community to stop crimes against humanity perpetrated by a government against its own people. Notice the difference between Crimea and Donbass - nobody shells the cities in Crimea - why? Because of full military presence of Russia. Putin of course didn't care about people and so…

> Clear case of Crimea

Yes. It is quite clear. Please explain me why Crimean Tatars have been kidnapped, murdered, interrogated, and repressed since Russia took over? (rhetorical)

http://khpg.org/en/index.php?id=1404852996

http://tsn.ua/politika/rosiya-hotili-zirvati-vistup-tatar-u-...

You can call it Imperial Racism - or just Rusczism.

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#64
post #54
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since when did defending your territory became 'ethnic cleansing'? Remind me, who went over the border? In a Ukrainian conflict, why do we keep hearing about Russian soldiers? Oh, and by the way, where did the bodies of 4000 dead Russian soldiers go? Wait, how did they get to Ukraine in the first place? http://euromaidanpress.com/2014/09/27/rights-activist-4000-r... And please, don't quite RT.

Defending your territory? From what, the people who already live there? The operations in the east were essentially punitive, simply because they didn't support the new government. Yanukovych never sent the army after the protesters, yet the new Kyiv government did... I don't know if you remember the sequence of events, but Donetsk never separated and formed an army until after the massive escalation of violence by t…

Incompetence is not with the Ukrainian army (maybe lack of finance is). The facts are there: Russia is invading Ukraine. http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/08/29...

If you still think there aren't any Russian soldiers, in Ukraine, there is a label for that: a troll. Russian soldiers have been killed, interviewed, captured, and shipped back to Russia (not in that particular order, of course) http://www.newsweek.com/2014/09/19/russian-soldiers-reveal-t...

And yes, defending your country from a Russian invasion is not 'ethnic cleansing': it's just defending your territory. It's not a conspiracy.

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#65
post #38

Used firechat in the area yesterday, I think there are two issues: 1. information overload, hard to catch up the messages from all the people 2. some people are spreading rumors and fake information. It would be great if we still can use the underlying network but have a way to filter out information (e.g. mgs from friends or friends or friends only)

2. some people are spreading rumors and fake information.

Yeah that would be government purposefully trying to sabotage the protests.

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#66

I wanted to like FireChat, as it was previously possible to use it entirely offline, in a purely P2P fashion. While this is still possible, you are now forced to first create an account online, and subscribe to a bunch of internet-based channels, before the app will let you use the P2P portion. This is frustrating. The market is wide open for someone to make a pure P2P communications app that doesn't require internet…

FireChat also doesn't encrypt communications, which makes it rather dangerous in such situations. There have already been reports of government agents infiltrating in the protest movement to install malware in their phones.

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#67
post #64
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Defending your territory? From what, the people who already live there? The operations in the east were essentially punitive, simply because they didn't support the new government. Yanukovych never sent the army after the protesters, yet the new Kyiv government did... I don't know if you remember the sequence of events, but Donetsk never separated and formed an army until after the massive escalation of violence by t…

Incompetence is not with the Ukrainian army (maybe lack of finance is). The facts are there: Russia is invading Ukraine. http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/08/29... If you still think there aren't any Russian soldiers, in Ukraine, there is a label for that: a troll. Russian soldiers have been killed, interviewed, captured, and shipped back to Russia (not in that particular order, of course) http:/…

> The facts are there: Russia is invading Ukraine.

Russia had invaded Ukraine and Ukraine could do nothing - Crimea.

The war in Donbass isn't "defending your country from a Russian invasion", it is volunteer battalions of nationalists, heavily armed and supported by Kiev government airforce, trying to pacify the region. Russia is supporting the rebels of course (for historic precedents read about "Zaporozskaya Sech" - it is amazing how history repeats itself). If Russia actually invaded, there wouldn't be any war already, like in Crimea. Several paratrooper battalions and tank assault groups occasionally performing some combat incursions isn't an invasion, just a favor to the rebels when it was absolutely critical for the survival of the rebellion (in August, months after Kiev started the "pacifying" operation).

Re: How Hong Kong Protesters Are Connecting, Without Cell or Wi-Fi Networks

#70
post #63
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if not for Russian volunteers and hardware (and soldiers in the August) the Donbass would be blood bathed. It is a duty of the international community to stop crimes against humanity perpetrated by a government against its own people. Notice the difference between Crimea and Donbass - nobody shells the cities in Crimea - why? Because of full military presence of Russia. Putin of course didn't care about people and so…

> Clear case of Crimea Yes. It is quite clear. Please explain me why Crimean Tatars have been kidnapped, murdered, interrogated, and repressed since Russia took over? (rhetorical) http://khpg.org/en/index.php?id=1404852996 http://tsn.ua/politika/rosiya-hotili-zirvati-vistup-tatar-u-... You can call it Imperial Racism - or just Rusczism.

if you know the centuries old history of that region and in particular of relations between Crimean Tatars and the rest of the population there, Russians included - you wouldn't be that surprised. Of course, Russia has a bunch of territories/ethnicities that wish (and have a lot of valid reasons to) they could go free like Estonia, Ukraine, Uzbekistan, ... did. Chechnya would be among the first coming to mind, and if somebody asked me i'd say let them go. Like Eltsin did in 91' - "take as much sovereignty as you can carry away". Well, as you said - Empire. And it is trying to come back. And it isn't a good Empire if there are any. And trying to oppress Russian minority on the border with that Empire - not a smart move by any accounts. Hoping that Western countries would help - not a smart hope as Western countries tend to not like (at least not publicly) oppressions of minorities these days.
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