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Ask HN: Three years to startup

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Re: Ask HN: Three years to startup

#21

Post by matt1 »

MicahWedemeyer wrote: post #10

I've been doing the nights & weekends thing for exactly 3 years today (9/11). My project is http://www.obsidianportal.com We're profitable but I still need a dayjob to pay the bills, so take my advice for what it's worth. 1. Shorter release schedule is always preferable. Like others have said 2 years to launch is a really bad idea. However, my question is: Where did you come up with these numbers? Do you have 2 diffe…

Micah, thanks.

My original thought process was that it'd be better to pick a long term ambitious project and launch a minimum viable product for it in two years (not a full project like I think I implied in the original post). As you and others pointed out though, I should shrink that even more until I have something that I can release in months, not years.

I have plenty of ideas, but they're mostly, in pg's words, science projects, not company ideas. See, for example, HNTrends.com. Neat idea, but not exactly something that's going to put food on the table.

There's pros and cons to looking for a big idea. If I identify something that I'm passionate about, execute it well, and lady luck is on my side, I'll be in good shape. But, the longer I drag my feet looking for a big idea, the more I increase the chances that I'll miss out by not simply executing a small idea and gradually growing it into something big. All that said, I think your initial direction matters a lot. I imagine many founders have had great ideas that they wish they could execute but they can't because they've committed to something else which is why I'm taking the time right now to figure things out.

I suppose what it all boils down to doing exactly what you said: find something you're passionate about. that'll take care of almost everything else.

Re: Ask HN: Three years to startup

#22

Post by elviejo »

petervandijck wrote: post #5

Ok: 1. How can you know that you still want to do this same startup in 3 years? You might get married. Get a kid. Get a great job. Loose your legs. Google might have launched your idea and killed your chances. Just saying. 2. A project that takes 2 years to launch is a recipe for failure. Really. A startup should take, say, 6 months to launch first beta, another 6 months to get really going and get users, during the…

Yeap imagine in 3 years you make 6 of those six-months projects/experiments.

That would give you an edge when you decide to start.

or maybe your third or fourth project / experiment is quite interesting and you decide to have two or 3 six months iterations on it.

In that case you've found yourself your startup.

Re: Ask HN: Three years to startup

#24

Post by auston »

petervandijck wrote: post #5

Ok: 1. How can you know that you still want to do this same startup in 3 years? You might get married. Get a kid. Get a great job. Loose your legs. Google might have launched your idea and killed your chances. Just saying. 2. A project that takes 2 years to launch is a recipe for failure. Really. A startup should take, say, 6 months to launch first beta, another 6 months to get really going and get users, during the…

> A startup should take, say, 6 months to launch first beta...

I think he may mean a web-based startup.

Re: Ask HN: Three years to startup

#25

Post by noodle »

matt1 wrote: post #18
noodle wrote: post #6

simple: your gameplan is to sit down and start working. push to get the minimum viable product - the minimum product that will bring in users/feedback/revenue. plan your initial timelines around this instead of the time you need to do everything you want. learn more about the things you need to know when they come up. you don't need full-time availabitlity to make a startup happen.

Thanks. I'm halfway through Four Steps to Epiphany. Great book--made me realize I've been doing a lot of things poorly. I can't tell you how many times I've spent months working on an app with high expectations only to launch it and realize it didn't solve the user's actual needs. Doh.

there's definitely something to be said for using tight design/build/deploy/feedback loops.

lets you make sure you're doing what your users want, instead of what you think they want. build and improve with their feedback in mind.

Re: Ask HN: Three years to startup

#26

Post by patio11 »

Three years into opening my business I'm at the point where, if I wanted, I could go full-time with it and not worry too much about my ability to put food on the table and a roof over my head. I suppose if I wanted to I could apply to a seed-fund, although candidly speaking taking other people's money is not something I see doing in my future unless it is in return for providing them goods or services.

My suggestion for you and any other person who wants to work on nights and weekends: above all else, ship something fast. Most people throw in the towel because they can't get into the positive feedback loop, it seems like it will take forever until they can get there, then ork gets busy and the baby gets sick and... and then they've forgotten about it.

Nothing replaces paying customers for giving ongoing motivation, feedback as to how to make your application better (via asking directly and reading the data about how they actually use it), and giving money to fund buying the things that you can't produce yourself (like, in your case, managed hosting).

Incidentally: although I'm definitely on the quick side of the bell curve, I took money for a product which was written (including the website to sell it and everything) in eight days. There is nothing wrong with taking six months to write something, but if you could have broken that into Phase 1: 1 month and Phase 2: 5 months you'd have money coming in, a website collecting links, customers giving suggestions, and MUCH less risk of building something no one wanted.

Re: Ask HN: Three years to startup

#27

Post by MicahWedemeyer »

matt1 wrote: post #21
MicahWedemeyer wrote: post #10

I've been doing the nights & weekends thing for exactly 3 years today (9/11). My project is http://www.obsidianportal.com We're profitable but I still need a dayjob to pay the bills, so take my advice for what it's worth. 1. Shorter release schedule is always preferable. Like others have said 2 years to launch is a really bad idea. However, my question is: Where did you come up with these numbers? Do you have 2 diffe…

Micah, thanks. My original thought process was that it'd be better to pick a long term ambitious project and launch a minimum viable product for it in two years (not a full project like I think I implied in the original post). As you and others pointed out though, I should shrink that even more until I have something that I can release in months, not years. I have plenty of ideas, but they're mostly, in pg's words, s…

I'm definitely not an advocate of "big ideas" but I do think people need to shoot higher than yet-another-twitter-app. There's a middle ground, where stuff like Basecamp sits. Not "enterprisey" but also not just a bullshit re-tweet bot.

And passion definitely won't take care of everything, but it will solve the motivation problem, which I think is the biggest problem that a nights & weekends company has. You still need to find customers and all that, and while passion helps, so too does having a useful, viable product.

I would suggest trying to get outside of the HN geek echo chamber. Ignore Twitter, the iPhone, and all the other hot stuff right now and try to find an area or group that's totally underserved on the web. Ask friends, girlfriends, family, etc. for ideas on things they hate about the Web. In my case, my wife found that small plant nurseries are stuck in like 1996 when it comes to the web, so we started http://doleaf.com Sure, it's not super-sexy, but it solves a real problem for these people, and they're willing to pay for it.

Re: Ask HN: Three years to startup

#28

Post by raffi »

I read some of the comments and others have probably said what I'm going to say. I wanted to startup too but due to other obligations (coughmilitary servicecough), I couldn't do it until I was... get this... 27. So I know how you feel. It's weird to watch friends do things and be successful and feel like you have to wait until your turn.

Every year I wanted to create something I called a cyber lemonade stand. Tim Ferris calls these muse businesses. I call it something simple where I charge money, people pay me, and I learn that I can do it. This is a big confidence builder and something you can start doing right away. http://www.feedbackarmy.com was my cyber lemonade stand, After the Deadline http://www.afterthedeadline.com was my startup.

What I find interesting is that I wasn't willing to take the steps towards the lemonade stand until I was out of the Air Force and had no job. If you're serious about starting up though, I really recommend you start on this concept right away. A small project will let you experiment with the things necessary to get something off the ground (contacting bloggers to generate PR, hiring out small stuff you can't do well yourself, etc).

Once you hit that magical time when you can startup--go for it. But you're thinking the right way trying to get some training in before the big race.

Re: Ask HN: Three years to startup

#29

Post by matt1 »

chrisconley wrote: post #13
vijayr wrote: post #9

Am I better off working on a a project that takes 4-6 month to build and launch or one that takes 18-24 months? Why not have both? What I mean is, take a big project, break it into smaller pieces of 3 months each (features 1-10 in first iteration, 11-20 in the second and so on). Since you'll be releasing early, you can gauge the response to your app, and adjust the next iteration according to the feedback (or even dr…

Exactly. Having a three year timeline allows you to have an overall strategy that you can incrementally build towards.

Speaking of iterating often, how's your project coming?

Re: Ask HN: Three years to startup

#30

Post by matt1 »

raffi wrote: post #28

I read some of the comments and others have probably said what I'm going to say. I wanted to startup too but due to other obligations ( cough military service cough ), I couldn't do it until I was... get this... 27. So I know how you feel. It's weird to watch friends do things and be successful and feel like you have to wait until your turn. Every year I wanted to create something I called a cyber lemonade stand. Tim…

Raffi you have a great story and one I hope to emulate one day. Best of luck with everything and congrats on your recent acquisition.
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