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Workaholism in America Is Hurting the Economy

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Re: Workaholism in America Is Hurting the Economy

#201

Post by toomuchtodo »

bmm6o wrote: post #128
mncolinlee wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The ad also inspired several parodies, including this one from Ford. The Cadillac ad is clearly trying to sell to an affluent, white, conservative audience which still believes their hard work and no vacation pays off. In the ad, they show their success with the car they drive. It's a study in market segmentation. Ford's parody spins it around by focusing on social consciousness, eco-friendliness, and diversity, a be…

Exactly. It's not so depressing when you realize that Cadillac is selling to generally older people who have already made these decisions. It's a 60 y.o. thinking "I did work hard, and I deserve a Cadillac", not a 25 y.o. thinking "I'm going to bust ass working for the Man so I can drive a Cadillac". Interestingly, the car is a hybrid, which is barely mentioned in the ad.

> Interestingly, the car is a hybrid, which is barely mentioned in the ad.

Its on the Volt platform. Not quite sure why GM is pushing it to that market segment if they're not touting any of the serial hybrid features.

Re: Workaholism in America Is Hurting the Economy

#202

Post by refurb »

whybroke wrote: post #143
refurb wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your example of the cost of medication is an odd one. Most (all?) states in the US have mandatory generic substitution. That means the pharmacy must fill your Rx with the generic unless the doctor wrote "Dispense as Written" on the Rx. Now, if the generic was not available in the US that is a different story. Patents don't all end at the same time, so the drug may already be off patent in the UK, but not in the US. F…

>The US has lower generic prices that most of the EU due to fierce competition for the US market This is not the case. From direct person experience I can attest that: Betaserc is 1/25 the price in Spain as the generic in the US Nebivolol is 1/10 Lovastatin is 1/5 Enalapril is 1/2

I have no doubt there are examples of cheaper generics in the EU than US, but overall, US generics are cheaper.[1]

[1]http://www.gabionline.net/Reports/Are-generic-medicines-too-...

Re: Workaholism in America Is Hurting the Economy

#203

Post by samstave »

bmm6o wrote: post #128
mncolinlee wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The ad also inspired several parodies, including this one from Ford. The Cadillac ad is clearly trying to sell to an affluent, white, conservative audience which still believes their hard work and no vacation pays off. In the ad, they show their success with the car they drive. It's a study in market segmentation. Ford's parody spins it around by focusing on social consciousness, eco-friendliness, and diversity, a be…

Exactly. It's not so depressing when you realize that Cadillac is selling to generally older people who have already made these decisions. It's a 60 y.o. thinking "I did work hard, and I deserve a Cadillac", not a 25 y.o. thinking "I'm going to bust ass working for the Man so I can drive a Cadillac". Interestingly, the car is a hybrid, which is barely mentioned in the ad.

ELR: Electric Luxury Ride

Re: Workaholism in America Is Hurting the Economy

#204

Post by ilyanep »

jtreminio wrote: post #167
ilyanep wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dislike seeing this sentiment all over HN just because it isn't as absolutely true as everyone wants to believe. I work for a company with unlimited vacation, and in my first 10 months working there will have taken ~3-3.5 weeks of vacation days cumulatively that I probably wouldn't have if I had to conserve a limited set of days. Nobody has given me crap over it, nor have I felt pressured to not take those days. It…

15 days vacation isn't unheard of in the tech world.

Sure. My point is, I would have saved much more days because "what if I wanted to take a week in August before my days roll over?" Maybe that's just my personality type.

Re: Workaholism in America Is Hurting the Economy

#205

Post by toomuchtodo »

patio11 wrote: post #78
ghshephard wrote: post #20

Even worse is the new trend in technology companies to eliminate "Set Vacation". It used to be the case that you felt "obliged" somehow to take your 10 days of vacation a year, because you saw it piling up. Even better, if you were laid off, you could get the vacation in cash, and that helped when you were cut off without a job. But now, a lot of technology companies are saying, "No Set Vacation - you need to negotia…

This is sometimes called -- in one of the most Orwellian coinages in the industry -- "unlimited vacation days."

I've just accepted a position at a YC startup with "unlimited vacation days". The founders seemed genuine when they said that as long as your work is getting done, it wasn't a problem.

I still agree that it causes ambiguity about how much time off is "too much".

Re: Workaholism in America Is Hurting the Economy

#206

Post by adventured »

gejjaxxita wrote: post #57
JackFr wrote: post #17

And yet compared to those European countries, the US experiences significantly higher GDP per capita. Doing work and getting paid for it hardly seems like it's hurting the economy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_%28PPP... As to the studies cited in the article I would point to the OECD labor productivity statistics which, in the aggregate, seem to disagree. http://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?Data…

The US has a lower population density than those European countries, more natural resource is divided between fewer people. That is the primary reason for the higher GDP per capita.

The facts don't bear out what you're saying.

The US is the world's second or first largest manufacturing nation (it's a close race with China currently, but they likely pulled ahead this year).

The US has the world's largest IT industry.

The US has the world's largest software industry.

The US has the world's largest internet / cloud industry.

The US has the world's largest telecom industry.

The US has the world's largest airlines, and railroads.

The US has the world's largest auto industry.

The US has the world's largest defense industry.

The US has the world's largest agriculture industry.

The US has the world's largest space industry.

The US has the world's largest retail industry.

The US has the world's largest capital markets.

The US has the world's largest real estate market, both commercial and residential.

The US has the world's largest advertising, marketing and design industries.

All of these things are not true simply because the US has natural resources. If it were simply a matter of resources per person, Norway would be the world's largest automaker or similar.

Re: Workaholism in America Is Hurting the Economy

#207

Post by whybroke »

zo1 wrote: post #180
whybroke wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The US has lower generic prices that most of the EU due to fierce competition for the US market This is not the case. From direct person experience I can attest that: Betaserc is 1/25 the price in Spain as the generic in the US Nebivolol is 1/10 Lovastatin is 1/5 Enalapril is 1/2

I quote the parent poster: "The US has lower generic prices that most of the EU " Emphasis mine. Perhaps, if they were consistently "cheaper" than the US, fine. But your singular example doesn't quite contradict the person you're responding to. So it actually is the case, unless you prove your findings for other EU countries. I have no idea if that's the case, just pointing out the obvious flaw in your logic. Perhaps…

Quite correct: I have no idea what the price is in Lichtenstein. Nor have I compared the price of every drug manufactured. Nor even a majority of those thousands.

I have, however bought a dozen or so different drugs and have done so in France, Italy, Croatia, Spain, Portugal and the Netherlands. All of which were tiny fraction of the price in the US.

So given two hypothesis: the US is cheaper vs the EU is cheaper, and a bunch of data points all pointing that same way, a little bit of Bayesian statistics shows us which hypothesis is over overwhelmingly more likely doesn't it? We can agree to use Bayesian statistics even though there's no entry in the conservapedia can't we?

Contrast, for example, with the parent poster's hypothesis which comes form no more data than a.m. radio infotainment, I think there's only one rational tentative conclusion don't you?

Re: Workaholism in America Is Hurting the Economy

#208

Post by gtremper »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #205
patio11 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is sometimes called -- in one of the most Orwellian coinages in the industry -- "unlimited vacation days."

I've just accepted a position at a YC startup with "unlimited vacation days". The founders seemed genuine when they said that as long as your work is getting done, it wasn't a problem. I still agree that it causes ambiguity about how much time off is "too much".

Same here. I wish they would give a target number of days to shoot for. I've even asked and I always get wishy-washy answers.

Re: Workaholism in America Is Hurting the Economy

#209

Post by Dewie »

adventured wrote: post #188
Dewie wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USA is the country with a domestic market of 300+ million people, largely English-speaking, and has not seen a war on its soil in modern times, right? Hard to compare to anything else, then. It's funny how people immediately just say because oil whenever it is brought up, and think that it magically explains everything. Yes, a ridiculous proportion of export is from that industry. But it's not like finding oil immedi…

Finding oil did make Norway prosperous. Have you ever looked at their economic condition prior to 1980?

Yes, it did. And how it is and has been managed is a large part of well it has worked for the country, which is a lot more involved and interesting than "Oil was found in the North Sea in the late 60's and everyone lived happily ever after, the end".

But since you seem to be an expert, how about you enlighten me on this subject.

Re: Workaholism in America Is Hurting the Economy

#210

Post by DrJones1098 »

ritchiea wrote: post #196
hueving wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Even if they make the same on all of their standardized tests, make the same grades, and go to the same college, and get the same degree..... >Who's going to be more successful with the same amount of hard work? Success is tied more to education than anything. Good education just also happens to be tied to wealth as well. So by framing it with them getting the same education, you have actually eliminated most of the…

You're underestimating the power of connections. I would never say that hard work won't make you successful in the US, but coming from a wealthy family creates a lot of opportunities earlier on in life that poor kids will have to work hard to see. Coming from a wealthy, or even upper middle class, family means maybe your summer senior year of high school is spent interning with your uncle's firm instead of working fo…

YES! Exactly this.

Passing down of beliefs and behaviors is almost more valuable than passing down money.

You're embedding positive or negative behaviors into someone's personality.

1>Passing down the belief that education is valuable

2>Passing down the belief that investing in the future is more valuable than short term spending.

etc.

Also having resources in general is a massive benefit. 1>having security allows wealthy kids to take more risks/reap more rewards.

2>More free time to learn and advance themselves

3>ability to take low paying jobs purely to make connections/build job skills

4>Status is a language that every one understands at a primitive level and so just getting more respect in general which means better promotions, better mates, etc.

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