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London black taxis plan congestion chaos to block Uber

bbc.co.uk

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Re: London black taxis plan congestion chaos to block Uber

#61

Post by cjrp »

bananas wrote: post #50
gadders wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had a neighbour that was doing the knowledge. We used to hear him practise in the back garden with his wife. Hearing her shout random routes at him like "Buckingham Palace to Bank Tube" and him spouting one road name after another was pretty amazing. If you're ever in London and you see a guy (or girl) on a bashed up moped with a clipboard strapped to the handlebars, they are learning their routes for The Knowledge…

Google is pretty good at that too and knows what the traffic is before you get there. It's impressive but no more impressive than navigating a 4 million line software product intuitively...

Google isn't (yet) quite as good at predicting traffic though. For example, a cabby would know that if a Chelsea game's finishing at 5pm, he should avoid Stamford Bridge.

Re: London black taxis plan congestion chaos to block Uber

#62

Post by robryan »

snitko wrote: post #23
nodata wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What a deplorable, luddite attitude. Well presumably you know their side of the story too? Presumably (hopefully someone who actually knows can fill us in) the taxi drivers have spent huge amounts of time learning The Knowledge and buying their cars and keeping to the fairly strict regulations that exist, and don't find it fair that another company can offer a service without a level playing field. Presumably.

If their knowledge is of any value to consumers, consumers are going to choose them over Uber. If not, then nobody should care. I can learn how to program stuff for MSDOS, doesn't mean it'd be worth anything these days. As for regulations and licensing, it shouldn't exist in the first place as it only raises prices and prevents legitimate competition.

To what end? Anyone with a car can start their own taxi service? I don't think it is in the public's interest to make taxi driving unprofitable which is what would likely happen without regulation and licensing.

Re: London black taxis plan congestion chaos to block Uber

#63

Post by buro9 »

stuaxo wrote: post #58
buro9 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just that, but black taxis have to operate under certain constraints and obligations. Examples are: not having the right to refuse a fare within 6 miles of the centre of London (usually taken as Charing Cross). Being obliged to have vehicles that are accessible to wheelchair and disabled users. Being obliged to take a vehicle out of service if it is damaged in any way (i.e. another vehicle clips your wing mirror…

Of course they do refuse fairs, and a couple of times I've heard the "I'm not going in that direction" reason.

Take their very visible taxi licence number, the place and time of day, and report them. The penalties are severe.

That said, if you're within 6 miles of Charing Cross they have no right to refuse... beyond that they are permitted to.

Re: London black taxis plan congestion chaos to block Uber

#64

Post by stuaxo »

bananas wrote: post #44

Screw the black cabs. I didn't realise what a rip off they are until I started driving around the city myself regularly with Google Maps which to be honest with traffic aware routing destroys "the knowledge" instantly. Black cab drivers know how to make cash, not the most efficient journeys in time and money. That meter hurts you badly. So they'll cause some chaos; good for them but it'll raise more awareness on the…

Really ? It's not too expensive. And it seems the workers get a much better deal than with Addisson Lee.

I make a point to use minicab firms if I'm not using a black cab, having spoken to a couple of drivers about the working conditions under Addilee.

Re: London black taxis plan congestion chaos to block Uber

#65

Post by robryan »

bananas wrote: post #44

Screw the black cabs. I didn't realise what a rip off they are until I started driving around the city myself regularly with Google Maps which to be honest with traffic aware routing destroys "the knowledge" instantly. Black cab drivers know how to make cash, not the most efficient journeys in time and money. That meter hurts you badly. So they'll cause some chaos; good for them but it'll raise more awareness on the…

Fair competition is great. It isn't a level playing field though if Uber can do everything a Taxi can without the extra obligations that add to overheads.

Re: London black taxis plan congestion chaos to block Uber

#66

Post by rwmj »

k-mcgrady wrote: post #17
corin_ wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Besides the ridiculous attempt to conflate Uber with evil bankers, it seems strange to suggest "most" of the profit will never be taxed in UK. Aren't all the UK drivers paying taxes? They would, yes - but when any big company gets bad press for not paying taxes in the UK (for example Google), nobody uses the excuse "but their staff in the UK still pay UK tax", the focus is on whether the company's profits are being…

>> "They would, yes - but when any big company gets bad press for not paying taxes in the UK (for example Google), nobody uses the excuse "but their staff in the UK still pay UK tax", the focus is on whether the company's profits are being taxed." Because the tax paid by employees is insignificant compared to the tax the company should be paying.

Umm, citation needed. Salaries are usually at least 50% of a company's expenses, and UK tax on salaries will be 30-40% of that, so that's at least 15-20%, likely more.

Re: London black taxis plan congestion chaos to block Uber

#67

Post by stuaxo »

raldi wrote: post #10

Note that the rank-and-file taxi drivers aren't complaining; they'll all get a chance to become Uber drivers. It's the incumbent taxi organization that's upset, because it's about to become a lot less powerful.

And we can all get a chance to swap our jobs for zero hours contracts, what a wonderful world.

Re: London black taxis plan congestion chaos to block Uber

#68

Post by nakedrobot2 »

nakedrobot2 wrote: post #39
nodata wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What a deplorable, luddite attitude. Well presumably you know their side of the story too? Presumably (hopefully someone who actually knows can fill us in) the taxi drivers have spent huge amounts of time learning The Knowledge and buying their cars and keeping to the fairly strict regulations that exist, and don't find it fair that another company can offer a service without a level playing field. Presumably.

Yes, I do know their side of the story, and I'm sorry to say that I still have the opinion written above. The Black Taxis are rather obsolete. As a consumer I don't really care that they learned The Knowledge since it won't help routing me around a traffic jam that just started a few minutes ago, to give one example!

Hi, To the person who is downvoting every one of my comments - if you disagree with me, please write a reply to me. Downvoting here on HN is meant only for people who are significantly detracting from the discussion. Thanks.

Re: London black taxis plan congestion chaos to block Uber

#70

Post by viraptor »

cjrp wrote: post #36
gadders wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ha. I'd be interested to see anyone manage that. On top of this, in central London it's pretty built up so SatNav doesn't always work in the canyons between buildings.

Plus a SatNav won't know that at rush hour, a longer (distance-wise) route could be quicker in a black cab due to them being allowed to use bus lanes.

Google maps already integrates with Uber. If they managed to get such connection, I'm not sure why a bigger black cab company operating in large cities couldn't get an agreement to include taxi/bus lanes on a separate app. Can't imagine Uber forced Google to cooperate with them...
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